Why aren't DSI desktops also designed to fit in a rack?

[timboréale]

Prophet 5/10 desktop: 20.75" wide
Rev2 Desktop: 21.6" wide
Prophet 6 desktop: 21.25" wide
OB-6 desktop: 20.75" wide

Heights range from 7.4" to 7.9", or roughly 5U.

...

The available width of a 19" rack is about 17" +/-. I'm a little baffled as to why the desktops weren't designed around that dimension, but rather went "really damn wide" even for a desktop. Adding a U of height would have made for a much more usable tabletop package as well, IMO. 6U is a perfectly acceptable size for a rackmount synth (the venerable OB-Mx is 6U and that's a wonderful rack interface, IMO, so there's no argument against it from a "it just doesn't work" perspective that I could find valid). They change the layout already (in the case of the P12 it's changed utterly) from the keyboard version, so trying to keep "some" compatibility can't be used as an excuse either.

I get that "rack mount synth" is a genre, but they didn't have to advertise them as rackable. They could still be sold with wooden end cheeks and just maybe an optional "one-size-fits all pair of rack ears" to go with them.

For their dimensions they don't work at all for me, though, and so I can confidently say that I'd rather buy the keyboard version, which inherently limits the number of DSI synths I will own, flat out. If they were rackable I could easily see adding another ... perhaps several, really.

You lose a ton of flexibility for transport and mounting and gain.... wasted desk space. I don't get it. Enlighten me, please?

(P.S. I am not looking for "here are ways to franken-pseudo-rack them"... the 19" rack standard is a standard and like it or not it's useful, human-scale, and ubiquitous. Standards are always procrustean beds, that's just how it is.)

[Indigo V.]

Part of the reason is probably that these desktop units sell better than rack units. People seem to want those knobs. There are a lot of people whos main reason to buy hardware are those damn knobs, not the sound quality. It's really stupid (in most situations). Also a lot of people seem to dislike external psus, an opinion I don't share either. You know, with external psus there would be more room to make desktop units fit into a rack. (maybe even with psu I don't remember exactly).

Another thing, although 80% off topic, are those damn keyboard-only versions. For studio synthesizers, this is soooo bad. 1 perfect sweet spot listening position + 1 midi master keyboard + 1 midi controller ( depending on master keyboard knobs) + Software Editors for the synthesizers (patch manager, nice recall etc.) = perfect for me.

This is so annoying by Moog but Sequential seem to be doing the same shit now, too, atleast to a certain extent. More than 10 years ago for sure.

[timboréale]

Well my point is that if they made the *desktop* (yeah, with the knobs) version in a slightly different format they could have their cake and fit it into a rack too. I don't consider this a limitation. The Vermona Perfourmer has a frack-ton of knobs and it fits beautifully into a rack AND looks great on a desktop.

If a desktop can be 21" wide and ~7.5" tall, you get the same general real estate by making it ~17" wide to fit a rack and 9" tall which is a perfect 6U anyway. Which is what I was suggesting.

[Indigo V.]

Well my point is ...

I know what your point is. My whole answer was written to support your point. I'm would get rid of all my synthesizers if I could replace them with rack versions.

[timboréale]

Ah, I read your first three sentences as saying that you thought a desktop and a rack were somehow viewed as different because of knobs. Not sure what the knobs have to do with it, is all, since either are just different proportions of the same thing with the same knobs. Anyways, glad to hear we agree!

I wouldn't get rid of any of my keyboards, but I'd certainly add more synths than I have now if there were more and better rackmount options out there that weren't all laminated-buttons and menu-divey (OB Matrix 6R and Crumar, I'm looking at you) or just no-buttons-worth-speaking-of (OB Matrix-1000 I'm looking at you too). I want knobs AND a rack, TYVM!

[hoodoo_ray]

This is so annoying by Moog but Sequential seem to be doing the same shit now, too, atleast to a certain extent. More than 10 years ago for sure.

Which synths do you mean regarding Sequential? They had desktop versions of the PE, Mopho, P08, P12, P6, OB6, P5, P10, and I’m sure we’ll see one for the Trigon. The Evolver and Tetra were desktop only.

The only ones I can think of which are keyboard only are the PX and the Pro series. The PX probably didn’t sell that well, and was likely thought of as a ‘player’s’ keyboard (I don’t like that term tbh but hopefully you know what I mean), and I guess the feeling with the Pro series is that they were smaller footprints anyway.

[Indigo V.]

This is so annoying by Moog but Sequential seem to be doing the same shit now, too, atleast to a certain extent. More than 10 years ago for sure.

Which synths do you mean regarding Sequential? They had desktop versions of the PE, Mopho, P08, P12, P6, OB6, P5, P10, and I’m sure we’ll see one for the Trigon. The Evolver and Tetra were desktop only.

Pro 2, Pro 3, Prophet X, Trigon (I'm sure we will not see a module), Oberheim X8.

Mopho, P08 etc. are all DSI units no longer in production since a decade+ and  are exactly the reason why I said that "Sequential SEEMS to go into the same DIRECTION, alteast TO SOME EXTENT".

[Indigo V.]

Ah, I read your first three sentences as saying that you thought a desktop and a rack were somehow viewed as different because of knobs.

Yes, that's exactly what I said. My impression is that people simply don't like rack versions because of the damn knobs and that is why companies don't build them anymore. I have my doubts that racks won't be profitable, because as you said, they are essientially the same so the research costs are low,  but I have no insider knowledge.

[chysn]

Why dis a specific company for not doing something that nobody else does? Why doesn't Panasonic make VHS players anymore? Damn Panasonic, it would be so easy to just retool a factory to make a few.

But seriously, the ergonomics of rackmount synths were atrocious, and it was probably an intractable problem.

[timboréale]

Why dis a specific company for not doing something that nobody else does?

Nobody? Every synth the fantastically successful Black Corporation currently makes is *designed* to fit in a rack. The desktop synths from Modal fit in a rack and even have rack kits. Moog made and likely will make again the Voyager and Slim Phatty in a rack and they're still going for serious money. Vermona's perfect perfourmer fits snugly in a rack. Shall I go on?

*digital* racks don't sell so well anymore, but analogue racks are alive and well and do just fine.

The reason I don't own more Sequential synths right now is that their desktops don't fit in a rack. And it's only a matter of changing the ratio of the rectangle they fit in. And I, for one, don't (agree? accept the validity of? find logical?) the argument that the rackmount format or ratio somehow hinders the interface, especially given all the examples to the contrary. 

That's really all I'm saying.

As an aside I think it would be super cool if *somebody* made a quality S-VHS mechanism so we could at least keep ADATs working... and I'd like to see a quality three-head tape deck with Dolby S and HX-Pro back on the market too, but one can dream. We used to say similar things about analogue, but now it's back and there's a good reason for it. Why be so negative about these mechanical, more human-scale technologies that have their own sonic and other quirks for which some of us find endearment?