Bug in the Take 5 Beta OS

[happyrat1]

Also should mention that MIDI 2.0 is disabled in Logic as well as Hydrasynth.

[lewisfrancis]

I've had the 2.0 update for about 2 weeks now.

MIDI problem with Logic Pro.  Using USB MIDI logic can read MIDI input, but does not output back to Take5.

Works fine with my other synths, including a Rev 2 so It's not a software issue.

I believe the problem is connected to the Soft MIDI Thru that is omitted from the new firmware.  In fact, MIDI Thru does not even exist anywhere in the global menus.

Please fix this issue quickly.

Thanks in advance.

Gary

Hey Gary, my T5 with the v2 firmware works fine for me in Logic using the USB connection for MIDI. Are you sure you have the T5 set as the destination in the External MIDI plugin?

I've tested and retested my MIDI configuration.

A recording made previously with the take 5 refuses toplay but I have the audio recorded as well and with audio muted, aven with take 5 soloed it can record MIDI but not play it back.  Also in my system Numa Compact 2x,  Prophet rev 2 16,  ASM hydrasynth,  Boss DR880, Behringer RD8, Alesis Samplepad Pro and Arturia Keystep Pro.

Everything behaves predictably except the Take 5.

Any other thoughts?

Gary...

There are multiple ways to connect and record external MIDI devices in Logic, which led to much confusion on my part when I first started. Still does, frankly, because some things work as expected in regular MIDI tracks but do not in tracks using the External MIDI Plugin, but the latter method is the easiest to work with.

Which method are you using, and how are your external MIDI devices connected to your Mac? I assume the T5 is connected via USB, which is how I currently connect mine. Most of the rest of my devices are connected via a MIDI Express 128 multiport interface where each device has a dedicated port.

If using the External MIDI plugin method, have you confirmed that the MIDI track that is not playing back on the T5 is actually assigned to the T5 in the External MIDI Plugin?

[happyrat1]

I've had the 2.0 update for about 2 weeks now.

MIDI problem with Logic Pro.  Using USB MIDI logic can read MIDI input, but does not output back to Take5.

Works fine with my other synths, including a Rev 2 so It's not a software issue.

I believe the problem is connected to the Soft MIDI Thru that is omitted from the new firmware.  In fact, MIDI Thru does not even exist anywhere in the global menus.

Please fix this issue quickly.

Thanks in advance.

Gary

Hey Gary, my T5 with the v2 firmware works fine for me in Logic using the USB connection for MIDI. Are you sure you have the T5 set as the destination in the External MIDI plugin?

I've tested and retested my MIDI configuration.

A recording made previously with the take 5 refuses toplay but I have the audio recorded as well and with audio muted, aven with take 5 soloed it can record MIDI but not play it back.  Also in my system Numa Compact 2x,  Prophet rev 2 16,  ASM hydrasynth,  Boss DR880, Behringer RD8, Alesis Samplepad Pro and Arturia Keystep Pro.

Everything behaves predictably except the Take 5.

Any other thoughts?

Gary...

There are multiple ways to connect and record external MIDI devices in Logic, which led to much confusion on my part when I first started. Still does, frankly, because some things work as expected in regular MIDI tracks but do not in tracks using the External MIDI Plugin, but the latter method is the easiest to work with.

Which method are you using, and how are your external MIDI devices connected to your Mac? I assume the T5 is connected via USB, which is how I currently connect mine. Most of the rest of my devices are connected via a MIDI Express 128 multiport interface where each device has a dedicated port.

If using the External MIDI plugin method, have you confirmed that the MIDI track that is not playing back on the T5 is actually assigned to the T5 in the External MIDI Plugin?

I'll run more tests on the weekend.

All connections are USB.  The MIDI works for the Arturia sequencer routed via USB to the T5  via Midifire, a Mac software MIDI Router so the Mac is sending rerouted info to the T5 successfully.

I see nothing different about my configurations for my other synths.  I have successfully recorded and played back MIDI sequences with logic configured to use the input channels on all synths as well as the Arturia sequencer before the update with totally predictable results.  There have been logic pro updates as well recently but this seems to be specific to the T5.

I am still suspicious that MIDI implementation is buggy because of the absence of MIDI thru control in the Globals Menus.

THAT sticks out like a sore thumb.

Am I missing something?

Gary

[lewisfrancis]

I've had the 2.0 update for about 2 weeks now.

MIDI problem with Logic Pro.  Using USB MIDI logic can read MIDI input, but does not output back to Take5.

Works fine with my other synths, including a Rev 2 so It's not a software issue.

I believe the problem is connected to the Soft MIDI Thru that is omitted from the new firmware.  In fact, MIDI Thru does not even exist anywhere in the global menus.

Please fix this issue quickly.

Thanks in advance.

Gary

Hey Gary, my T5 with the v2 firmware works fine for me in Logic using the USB connection for MIDI. Are you sure you have the T5 set as the destination in the External MIDI plugin?

I've tested and retested my MIDI configuration.

A recording made previously with the take 5 refuses toplay but I have the audio recorded as well and with audio muted, aven with take 5 soloed it can record MIDI but not play it back.  Also in my system Numa Compact 2x,  Prophet rev 2 16,  ASM hydrasynth,  Boss DR880, Behringer RD8, Alesis Samplepad Pro and Arturia Keystep Pro.

Everything behaves predictably except the Take 5.

Any other thoughts?

Gary...

There are multiple ways to connect and record external MIDI devices in Logic, which led to much confusion on my part when I first started. Still does, frankly, because some things work as expected in regular MIDI tracks but do not in tracks using the External MIDI Plugin, but the latter method is the easiest to work with.

Which method are you using, and how are your external MIDI devices connected to your Mac? I assume the T5 is connected via USB, which is how I currently connect mine. Most of the rest of my devices are connected via a MIDI Express 128 multiport interface where each device has a dedicated port.

If using the External MIDI plugin method, have you confirmed that the MIDI track that is not playing back on the T5 is actually assigned to the T5 in the External MIDI Plugin?

I'll run more tests on the weekend.

All connections are USB.  The MIDI works for the Arturia sequencer routed via USB to the T5  via Midifire, a Mac software MIDI Router so the Mac is sending rerouted info to the T5 successfully.

I see nothing different about my configurations for my other synths.  I have successfully recorded and played back MIDI sequences with logic configured to use the input channels on all synths as well as the Arturia sequencer before the update with totally predictable results.  There have been logic pro updates as well recently but this seems to be specific to the T5.

I am still suspicious that MIDI implementation is buggy because of the absence of MIDI thru control in the Globals Menus.

THAT sticks out like a sore thumb.

Am I missing something?

Gary

Huh, not familiar with Midifire -- is that an Apple Audio MIDI Setup replacement? Maybe that's where your problem lies, it's certainly a difference in our setups and I have no problem getting the T5 to respond to Logic MIDI across the USB interface.

Not sure why you are focused on the soft-through feature. I guess it'd be nice to have but it's not something I would need.

[Oblong]

It's good to note that the soft thru feature could be allowing a MIDI feedback loop to form. We usually advise shutting off any soft thru-type functionality.

There's also the really great iConnectivity Mio, an affordable USB-to-MIDI DIN cable type interface, just sayin!

[happyrat1]

Actually it's my understanding that MIDIfire is actually quite a popular Soft MIDI Router on the mac and there are prpecious few out there to choose from.

I believe it's origins might lie in the JACK audio connection kit popular in so many linux dustributions.

I use it frequently but I have tried with it running or turned off and no difference.

All previously said in this thread has been tested with MIDIfire running or not.

I think Oblong sees my train of thought and this will have to be left til the next firmware upgrade.

The omission of USB MIDI Thru Opetions in the Globals Menu tells me that this was not implemented properly to spec in the first place.

Gary

[Oblong]

Actually, the Take 5's USB MIDI functionality is complete, and is the same as our other instruments. In 99% of cases like this, the issue lies with DAW software and/or MIDI routing setups. Local Off is helpful, as is making sure you are not allowing MIDI loopback to occur.

Always a good idea to reach out to support@sequential.com if you have continued issues.

[happyrat1]

Actually, the Take 5's USB MIDI functionality is complete, and is the same as our other instruments. In 99% of cases like this, the issue lies with DAW software and/or MIDI routing setups. Local Off is helpful, as is making sure you are not allowing MIDI loopback to occur.

Always a good idea to reach out to support@sequential.com if you have continued issues.

Then why does the problem not rear its ugly head when using the Rev 2 16 at the same time?  Take 5 on channel 7 and Prophet on channel 12?   DAW configurations are identical.

[happyrat1]

Firmware 1.0.0.2 did not exhibit this behaviour.

[lewisfrancis]

Then why does the problem not rear its ugly head when using the Rev 2 16 at the same time?  Take 5 on channel 7 and Prophet on channel 12?   DAW configurations are identical.

Why are you bothering to set a MIDI channel for the Take 5? Is it not connected to your machine via the USB bus?

[happyrat1]

Then why does the problem not rear its ugly head when using the Rev 2 16 at the same time?  Take 5 on channel 7 and Prophet on channel 12?   DAW configurations are identical.

Why are you bothering to set a MIDI channel for the Take 5? Is it not connected to your machine via the USB bus?

USB MIDI is an industry standard spec and channels and device IDs are still used to route MIDI signals properly over the USB Bus.

Gary

[lewisfrancis]

Then why does the problem not rear its ugly head when using the Rev 2 16 at the same time?  Take 5 on channel 7 and Prophet on channel 12?   DAW configurations are identical.

Why are you bothering to set a MIDI channel for the Take 5? Is it not connected to your machine via the USB bus?

USB MIDI is an industry standard spec and channels and device IDs are still used to route MIDI signals properly over the USB Bus.

Gary

You must use channels if using MIDI DIN connections and daisy-chaining, or when controlling a multitimbral device, but fwiw that's unnecessary when using the Take 5's USB interface in Logic -- you can just set the track MIDI Destination to the Take 5 and not have to worry about channels anymore. It's a beautiful thing.

[happyrat1]

Then why does the problem not rear its ugly head when using the Rev 2 16 at the same time?  Take 5 on channel 7 and Prophet on channel 12?   DAW configurations are identical.

Why are you bothering to set a MIDI channel for the Take 5? Is it not connected to your machine via the USB bus?

USB MIDI is an industry standard spec and channels and device IDs are still used to route MIDI signals properly over the USB Bus.

Gary

You must use channels if using MIDI DIN connections and daisy-chaining, or when controlling a multitimbral device, but fwiw that's unnecessary when using the Take 5's USB interface in Logic -- you can just set the track MIDI Destination to the Take 5 and not have to worry about channels anymore. It's a beautiful thing.

It's not that beautiful.  It changes an industry standard with unpredictable results.  Case in point, multisynth setups.

[lewisfrancis]

Then why does the problem not rear its ugly head when using the Rev 2 16 at the same time?  Take 5 on channel 7 and Prophet on channel 12?   DAW configurations are identical.

Why are you bothering to set a MIDI channel for the Take 5? Is it not connected to your machine via the USB bus?

USB MIDI is an industry standard spec and channels and device IDs are still used to route MIDI signals properly over the USB Bus.

Gary

You must use channels if using MIDI DIN connections and daisy-chaining, or when controlling a multitimbral device, but fwiw that's unnecessary when using the Take 5's USB interface in Logic -- you can just set the track MIDI Destination to the Take 5 and not have to worry about channels anymore. It's a beautiful thing.

It's not that beautiful.  It changes an industry standard with unpredictable results.  Case in point, multisynth setups.

How so?

[happyrat1]

BUG SOLVED!!!

It was a PEBKAC Error. 

Problem Existed Between Keyboard And Chair!!! 

I suddenly realized that I hadn't reset my globals after the update!!!

THAT SHOULD BE A LARGE PRINT WARNING at the end of the page.

I suddenly recalled a similar problem with a Rev2 update last year and it hit me like a ton of bricks.

I apologize for any insinuations against the firmware but truth be told it is a surprisingly easy error to make with occasionally devastating consequences.

Forewarned is fore armed as they say

And all's well that ends well.

Thanks for your efforts.

Gary

[Oblong]

Glad to hear there was a simple solution! To note, we always advise resetting globals on all update docs.