Prophet 6 vs OB-6

[Motion Drive]

I have to confess, after 3 weeks owning both, the OB6 and the P6, I have a clear preference to the OB6. The reason why, is mainly because the OB6 fits better into my productions. The P6 somehow sounds always a bit "far away", "dull", "softer" and much less "in your face" then the OB and its more difficult to make it shine in a Mix. The Ob seems much louder as well and the P6 is clipping much faster. At least that's my experience until now.

When I play with the P6, I like what I hear. But as soon as I try to do some sounds for actual projects, I'm having troubles making the sounds shine in the Mix. With the OB I don't have those problems at all.

Honestly I'm a bit confused now..lol, but I'm tending to sell the P6 and get a Pro 2 instead...only because it I get a much broader sound palette.

One thing is for sure...both synth are great...but owning both, for me seems a bit a overkill. I mean, those synths shine most on the classic sounds like Leads, Pads, Baselines etc., so one is enough. I might prefer to get a Pro 2 instead for some more "out of this world" sounds, the P6 / OB6 cant achieve.

[Hector Space]

I've been lucky enough to own and enjoy a Prophet 6 for 5mnths now. It is a thing of sonic beauty. It isn't stuck in a time warp nor is it so futuristic to be impractical for everyday gigging. Dave and his team have got the balance right between yesterday and tomorrow. I started my synth journey back in the 70's when analog was analog and Moog and ARP were the kings. Then along came the Oberheim 4 voice, first heard for me on Weather Report's Heavy Weather classic. It wasn't until the 80's that I finally got my hands on an ObXa and a Prophet 5. Both were beautiful but different. To me the Oberheim was more like a Hammond on acid whereas the P5 was tight weird and modern (Japan). Ok there was a huge area of common ground between them but in the end it was the P5's filter and mod facilities that won me over.
I got a chance to spend a few hours with the Ob6 yesterday. It is gorgeous. The thing that stands out above anything else is that filter - it is way better than anything the ObXa had, but still manages to produce that gritty ObXa sound. It takes you to places you couldn't go with the P6 and, to me, totally justifies the instrument's parallel existence at DSI.
Is it better than my P6? No! Would I have both.. Yes please!

[Motion Drive]

I guess, I just have to give the P6 some more time to grow. Maybe the problem lies as well in the limited modulation possibilities of both. Having one synth like this is ok...but two maybe is a bit too much for me as a big modulation fan. Adding for example a Pro 2 would maybe be a better companion in my case.

Anyway...don't want to hijack the tread with my personal issues with those two...as mention both are great, the OB6 just fits my personal taste better. And to be honest...quite nice as a problem..lol...having those two

[DavidDever]

I have to confess, after 3 weeks owning both, the OB6 and the P6, I have a clear preference to the OB6. The reason why, is mainly because the OB6 fits better into my productions. The P6 somehow sounds always a bit "far away", "dull", "softer" and much less "in your face" then the OB and its more difficult to make it shine in a Mix. The Ob seems much louder as well and the P6 is clipping much faster. At least that's my experience until now.

When I play with the P6, I like what I hear. But as soon as I try to do some sounds for actual projects, I'm having troubles making the sounds shine in the Mix. With the OB I don't have those problems at all.

Honestly I'm a bit confused now..lol, but I'm tending to sell the P6 and get a Pro 2 instead...only because it I get a much broader sound palette.

One thing is for sure...both synth are great...but owning both, for me seems a bit a overkill. I mean, those synths shine most on the classic sounds like Leads, Pads, Baselines etc., so one is enough. I might prefer to get a Pro 2 instead for some more "out of this world" sounds, the P6 / OB6 cant achieve.

There's quite a bit of difference between the SSM(-style) filter of the rev 1 Prophet-5 / Prophet-6 and the Curtis filter(s) of the rev 2/3 Prophet-5 / Prophet '08; likewise, the SEM filter sounds quite different than the OB-Xa's Curtis filters. A Pro-2 + a Prophet '08 / Tetra / Mopho x4 would probably cover most of the bases.

[smithymicky1]

Wow! Thanks for posting direct links to each of these sound examples, they are AMAZING! Many of them are kind of modern I was thinking about... I have heard lots of OB-6 demos giving off similar types of quirky and cool sounds and notes, and was hoping that the Prophet 6 was capable of this type of stuff for some trance/fat bass/wierd and wonderful stuff too.

Thanks! Yeah, it's absolutely possible to get quirky and weird sounds out of the Prophet-6 just as much as randomly self-evolving drones. In that regard both the Prophet-6 and the OB-6 are technically capable of the same sonic diversity, although I personally would say that the OB-6's filter identity is always more obvious. But don't forget that you can also use the Prophet's high and low-pass filters to emulate a bandpass filter. All in all I have to say that given that both of these synths are fairly conservative in terms of modulation options, they surprisingly cover a lot of sonic territory. It's not that they only do typical pads, leads, and basses.

I watched the first episode to Stranger Things tonight, and was blown away by the synth sounds used in the opening title.. I guess both the OB and Prophet would be suited to similar arpeggios to that with similar filter effects? How did you get the arpeggiator recording out to Ableton Live?

I've read that they used a Prophet-6 quite a bit for the recordings: http://www.salon.com/2016/07/23/obsessed_with_stranger_things_meet_the_band_behind_the_shows_spine_chilling_theme_and_synth_score/

I'm not quite sure what you mean by the question about how I got the arpeggiator recording out to Ableton Live. I just recorded arpeggiated patches directly into Live. The MIDI data Live recorded were just the notes I played on the Prophet-6, but since the arpeggiator was activated on the according patches, the arpeggios would of course be reproduced during the playback for the audio recording. But in most cases I recorded audio and MIDI simultaneously anyway.

So does the arpeggiator not record just to midi, and instead you have to record straight audio in Ableton?
PS is the Prophet 6 capable of dark bass at a level similar to the OB?

[smithymicky1]

In particular, the sound demos I have heard mostly of the Prophet 6 have a 70's/80s feel to them (which is awesome by the way!), but many of the patches recorded in this Soundcloud demo of the OB-6 sound quite modern: https://soundcloud.com/syntheticthings/dave-smith-instruments-ob-6-sound-demo

Is the Prophet 6 just as capable of making these modern types of sounds  (I guess in it's own less wild way?)

Mike

Hi Mike,

since you posted this soundcloud track as an example, can you point to some specific parts in the demo that you consider modern types of sounds?

Soundcloud lets you copy the URL for a specific time in a track, by clicking Share and then clicking the "at [time]" checkbox to the right of the URL. For example:
https://soundcloud.com/syntheticthings/dave-smith-instruments-ob-6-sound-demo#t=3:58

Sorry about the late reply!
https://soundcloud.com/syntheticthings/dave-smith-instruments-ob-6-sound-demo#t=0:02 - The very first sound!
https://soundcloud.com/syntheticthings/dave-smith-instruments-ob-6-sound-demo#t=3:54
https://soundcloud.com/syntheticthings/dave-smith-instruments-ob-6-sound-demo
https://soundcloud.com/syntheticthings/dave-smith-instruments-ob-6-sound-demo#t=12:30

Looking back at that demo, it probably wasn't the best one to describe that modern sound I have heard from the OB...
Would something like this be achievable with the filters on the Prophet 6?: https://soundcloud.com/davesmithinstruments/ob-6-filter-delight#t=0:47

I love that slow pass down to low at that point! (I have read that some people don't rate the high pass filter on the Prophet?)

Also in particular a brilliant type of sound I have heard comes from Peter Dyer's demo of the OB-6: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=51cADWLdC1E
Particularly at 0:18 - 1:01!

[PaulSchilling]

Indeed. Don't know if you've listened to these audio examples (the first recordings posted in the paragraph "Les voix du maître"), a quiz that compares a Prophet-5 Rev. 3 and a Prophet-6 without saying which one is which:
http://fr.audiofanzine.com/synthe-analogique/sequential-circuits/prophet-6/editorial/tests/le-retour-du-roi.html

wow this is great, thanks for posting that. Even though some of the patches were still not tweaked close enough (the Clav for example), this is one of the best Prophet-6 comps/reviews I've seen. They really knew what they were doing.

I have a rule of thumb that when doing a side by side synth comparison you have to spend at least 30 minutes tweaking per patch, to get it close enough. For some patches I've spent hours tweaking. Even something simple like the slightest difference in volume levels will result in a big (perceived) difference for most listeners.

[Paul Dither]

So does the arpeggiator not record just to midi, and instead you have to record straight audio in Ableton?

I'm still not sure what exactly you're asking for. An arpeggiator doesn't record anything, it just plays back arpeggiated notes based on the ones you're holding down on the keyboard and based on the arpeggiator settings (up, down, up+down, random, octave range, etc.).
Are you asking whether the arpeggiator sends out the arpeggiated notes as MIDI notes? - In that case: no, it doesn't. But the Prophet-6 sends out the MIDI note data, the notes you play whether an arpeggiator is activated or not, so there's still no need for recording straight to audio.

PS is the Prophet 6 capable of dark bass at a level similar to the OB?

The Prophet-6 is no Oberheim, so if you want an Oberheim-ish sound, you'd rather need to get an OB-6 or a SEM module by Tom Oberheim. In that sense it's pretty much like it was with the Prophet-5 and the OB-X, or OB-Xa.

[Paul Dither]

Would something like this be achievable with the filters on the Prophet 6?: https://soundcloud.com/davesmithinstruments/ob-6-filter-delight#t=0:47

Short answer: no. That sound needs this particular 12 dB filter.

[Paul Dither]

Indeed. Don't know if you've listened to these audio examples (the first recordings posted in the paragraph "Les voix du maître"), a quiz that compares a Prophet-5 Rev. 3 and a Prophet-6 without saying which one is which:
http://fr.audiofanzine.com/synthe-analogique/sequential-circuits/prophet-6/editorial/tests/le-retour-du-roi.html

wow this is great, thanks for posting that. Even though some of the patches were still not tweaked close enough (the Clav for example), this is one of the best Prophet-6 comps/reviews I've seen. They really knew what they were doing.

I have a rule of thumb that when doing a side by side synth comparison you have to spend at least 30 minutes tweaking per patch, to get it close enough. For some patches I've spent hours tweaking. Even something simple like the slightest difference in volume levels will result in a big (perceived) difference for most listeners.

Did you find out which one is which?

[smithymicky1]

In particular, the sound demos I have heard mostly of the Prophet 6 have a 70's/80s feel to them (which is awesome by the way!), but many of the patches recorded in this Soundcloud demo of the OB-6 sound quite modern: https://soundcloud.com/syntheticthings/dave-smith-instruments-ob-6-sound-demo

Is the Prophet 6 just as capable of making these modern types of sounds  (I guess in it's own less wild way?)

Mike

Hi Mike,

since you posted this soundcloud track as an example, can you point to some specific parts in the demo that you consider modern types of sounds?

Soundcloud lets you copy the URL for a specific time in a track, by clicking Share and then clicking the "at [time]" checkbox to the right of the URL. For example:
https://soundcloud.com/syntheticthings/dave-smith-instruments-ob-6-sound-demo#t=3:58

PS, I guess the following is similar to one of the sounds I am chasing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SdHBkYoUXOs
In your opinions do you feel that type of sound (particularly the intro) could be achieved with Prophet 6 or would it be better with the OB?

 

[Matthew John]

I own both the P-6 and OB-6. They complement each other well and are surprisingly versatile. The link I posted is a children's Halloween video, and I did the music and sound design for it using only the P-6 and OB-6. I found it amazing how far you can take these synths despite the relatively limited modulation capabilities (compared to digital synths).  All the door squeaks and knocks, thunder sounds, monster noises, music, percussion, etc. -- everything you hear except the singing/talking and the brief audience clapping in the middle -- was done on the OB-6 and P-6. It's an equal blend of both synths. Which one is better for sound fx? It was more or less a coin toss in deciding which synth to use for a particular sound because both synths are up to the task. And for the music? The signature of the OB-6 is more noticeable due to the filter, and for that reason it is possible that the P-6 is ever slightly more versatile.  I am not 100% set on that angle, but it's what pops into mind after several extensive sound design and music production gigs with both units.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=efW0xpqMvto

[DavidDever]

Interesting result - I'd bet that the P-6 sits better into the mix after dialogue normalization / mix compression; I have a pretty good guess as to which elements were which....

(and with a toddler at home, believe me - I get exposed to this more than most....)

[Sacred Synthesis]

Excellent sound effects.  The door knocks and creaks, thunder claps, and tolling bell were very convincing

[Matthew John]

Interesting result - I'd bet that the P-6 sits better into the mix after dialogue normalization / mix compression; I have a pretty good guess as to which elements were which....

(and with a toddler at home, believe me - I get exposed to this more than most....)

Indeed, the P-6 blends very well...very easy to mix. But the OB-6 blends well too, even if sometimes it requires slightly more tinkering (though not always). With these synths I can usually get pretty close to the final mix sound before starting to mix. 

I've got two toddlers at home so even my productions for grown-ups end up sounding like kids' songs. I guess that's ok 'cause I'm a hippie...lol

[Matthew John]

Excellent sound effects.  The door knocks and creaks, thunder claps, and tolling bell were very convincing

Thank you! It was a lot of fun to make. In fact, doing that project (there were other songs involved too) sort of 'cured' me of burnout which I was facing because of so many 12 hour days doing sound/music stuff.  I had decided to just use the DSI synths to get to know them better and in that process I found them so much fun to work with. I am huge fan of digital synths too, but these DSI synths make work fun -- and they sound great!

[DJKeys]

Excellent sound effects.  The door knocks and creaks, thunder claps, and tolling bell were very convincing

Thank you! It was a lot of fun to make. In fact, doing that project (there were other songs involved too) sort of 'cured' me of burnout which I was facing because of so many 12 hour days doing sound/music stuff.  I had decided to just use the DSI synths to get to know them better and in that process I found them so much fun to work with. I am huge fan of digital synths too, but these DSI synths make work fun -- and they sound great!

Very Impressive track! 

-dj

[Matthew John]

Very Impressive track! 

-dj

Thank you DJKeys!

[smithymicky1]

I own both the P-6 and OB-6. They complement each other well and are surprisingly versatile. The link I posted is a children's Halloween video, and I did the music and sound design for it using only the P-6 and OB-6. I found it amazing how far you can take these synths despite the relatively limited modulation capabilities (compared to digital synths).  All the door squeaks and knocks, thunder sounds, monster noises, music, percussion, etc. -- everything you hear except the singing/talking and the brief audience clapping in the middle -- was done on the OB-6 and P-6. It's an equal blend of both synths. Which one is better for sound fx? It was more or less a coin toss in deciding which synth to use for a particular sound because both synths are up to the task. And for the music? The signature of the OB-6 is more noticeable due to the filter, and for that reason it is possible that the P-6 is ever slightly more versatile.  I am not 100% set on that angle, but it's what pops into mind after several extensive sound design and music production gigs with both units.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=efW0xpqMvto

Wow, that was great! Well done on that track, I loved the sound design
That long low note near the end that comes in at about 3:01, was that done with the OB-6?
One thing that I have been wondering, when people talk about that Oberheim signature sound that can be heard on the OB-6, is that the buzz sound that I would have heard in several OB-6 demos which is kind of like a permanent sawtooth wave sound? Can the OB-6 make sounds without that slight buzz to it?

[Matthew John]

"Wow, that was great! Well done on that track, I loved the sound design
That long low note near the end that comes in at about 3:01, was that done with the OB-6?
One thing that I have been wondering, when people talk about that Oberheim signature sound that can be heard on the OB-6, is that the buzz sound that I would have heard in several OB-6 demos which is kind of like a permanent sawtooth wave sound? Can the OB-6 make sounds without that slight buzz to it?"



Thank you!  You nailed it: that long low note that comes in at around 3:01 is indeed from the OB-6.   

That sound that you describe, the one which differentiates the OB-6 from the P-6 derives mostly from the mechanics of the oscillators and the 2-pole, 12dB per octave filter.  That type of filter allows more frequencies above the cutoff point to slip through. This makes it easier to get that 'buzzy' or 'gritty' sound if you wish. However, the synth is more than capable of making sounds that are not in that vein.