Velocity inconsistent

Velocity inconsistent
« on: November 04, 2022, 03:36:30 AM »
Hello everyone,

I have just bought a used Pro 3 and played on it last evening. The velocity of the keyboard seem to be very inconsistent, curve 1 and 2 for example are completely unusable because the velocity jumps between a difference of up to 30 in velocity althought I'm applying the same pressure. The only curve which I can use is curve 6 because it limits the velocity values to a minimum of 50 and it is hard to reach values over 111 without smashing the keys. But this takes away a lot of expression. Using the mod matrix instead of 'velocity on' helps, but the end it doesn't solve the problem that the values seem to jump a lot.

Anyway, I get the impression that something is off with the keybed. I'm a little bit disappointed because I lose a lot of expression. I asked another keyboarder which curve he is using and he said curve 1. This makes me very suspicious because for me curve 1 is completely unusable. I'm currently thinking about contacting the person who sold me the board and expressing to him that it's off, but I have no reference whether other pro 3s behave in a same way. What should I do?
« Last Edit: November 04, 2022, 03:42:54 AM by tommikvnze »

chysn

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Re: Velocity inconsistent
« Reply #1 on: November 04, 2022, 04:19:08 AM »
It's not supposed to behave like that, of course. I'd start by opening it up and re-seating the cable from the keyboard to the PCB. If it didn't do this in the store, the cable might have come loose during transport. If that doesn't work, contact Sequential support, and they can probably get it sorted out in short order.
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he/him/his

Re: Velocity inconsistent
« Reply #2 on: November 04, 2022, 06:14:05 AM »
I uploaded a video which shows the incoming velocity values in ableton.

https://youtu.be/MrNUC3To_SA

The setting is curve 1.
First I try to play one note consistently. It's a black note where the issue is even worse.

Then I try to play consistently over the keys. You'll see that the values jump, sometimes some notes go down close to 1 which results in very sudden shifts in sound. It makes it really hard to keep a consistent tone.

« Last Edit: November 04, 2022, 07:10:29 AM by tommikvnze »

Elric

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Re: Velocity inconsistent
« Reply #3 on: November 04, 2022, 12:33:01 PM »
One thing to note/check, is that the Velocity button makes velocity go from zero to the envelopes Amount value. While the matrix' Velocity control *starts* from the Amount setting value, and goes plus or minus from there. They are basically opposite of each other.

I mostly don't use the button when I'm making a patch. It's not adjustable.
:Elric:
Kurzweil K, Pro3, TX81z, K1r, Triton w/MOSS, Wavestation EX in a bag in the corner.

Elric

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Re: Velocity inconsistent
« Reply #4 on: November 05, 2022, 08:57:09 PM »

Just had a thought... 
If you have another MIDI keyboard, try playing the Pro3 from it, to compare.
(Or play other synths from the Pro3 keyboard.)
I love playing my Pro3 from my Kurzweil.
:Elric:
Kurzweil K, Pro3, TX81z, K1r, Triton w/MOSS, Wavestation EX in a bag in the corner.

Re: Velocity inconsistent
« Reply #5 on: November 06, 2022, 01:32:34 AM »
Oh, I will try another keyboard. Thats a great idea. Iím in touch with the sequential support. They asked me to record the midi messages and send it to them. Lets see what they say on monday.

Re: Velocity inconsistent
« Reply #6 on: November 06, 2022, 02:45:14 AM »
I have tested my bass station 2 as keyboard. I was able to play smoothly crescendo and decrescendo without any jumps.

Elric

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Re: Velocity inconsistent
« Reply #7 on: November 06, 2022, 07:20:09 PM »
I have tested my bass station 2 as keyboard. I was able to play smoothly crescendo and decrescendo without any jumps.

Just out of curiosity.... maybe try playing the Bass Station 2 from the Pro3 keyboard?

... I have seen a few mentions/complaints about the Pro3 keyboard's After-Touch control having a very short/quick range [just in the 'middle' ...of the pressure range]. And I've noticed that myself.
 Have you tried the after-touch control yet? (It's just "monophonic"/per-channel.)

Also, for the Velocity problem, is it just certain notes/keys? - Like the one you specify? - Or is it any key.

Anyway, just ideas / curiosity... feel free to ignore.
good luck.
« Last Edit: November 06, 2022, 07:25:06 PM by Elric »
:Elric:
Kurzweil K, Pro3, TX81z, K1r, Triton w/MOSS, Wavestation EX in a bag in the corner.

Re: Velocity inconsistent
« Reply #8 on: November 07, 2022, 12:28:35 AM »
Yes, I did play the bass station 2 from the Pro 3 Keyboard. It's also hard to control the bass stations velocity consistently. Th problem exist on all keys, but the black ones are worse.

I have not tried anything specific with the aftertouch because I don't have a problem with it.

Elric

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Re: Velocity inconsistent
« Reply #9 on: January 23, 2023, 09:24:51 PM »
I love playing my Pro3 from my Kurzweil.

^^
...Have you ever played your Pro3 from a nice controller keyboard?
So sweet.

Also, this brings up the fact that Fatar keybeds have been failing for many years at handling the "dynamic control".
Mostly the aftertouch-curve (has been TERRIBLE), but also the velocity response.

Osmose should wake them up, huh?
:Elric:
Kurzweil K, Pro3, TX81z, K1r, Triton w/MOSS, Wavestation EX in a bag in the corner.