Firmware update feature requests/bugs

Re: Firmware update feature requests/bugs
« Reply #20 on: September 15, 2022, 01:39:18 PM »
Would love to be able to hold the page 2 button and turn a knob or touch something like OSC 2 or Noise and for it to bring up the page 2 parameter.

Like to add a second feature request. Be able to save global tuning per patch. Global tuning is global as it is now and per patch tuning in page 2.

Re: Firmware update feature requests/bugs
« Reply #21 on: September 19, 2022, 06:25:46 PM »
Feature request:

1. "Saved value indicator" - Add a feature to indicate when you've returned to the "saved" value after tweaking a particular knob/parameter (e.g. Filter cutoff, Filter mod, Attack etc.). The OB-6 and Prophet 5/10 achieve this by lighting up the rightmost LED decimal point segment. Would love to have something similar on my OB-X8, as it's immensely helpful in deconstructing a patch, as well as to return to the stored value after real-time tweaking.

2. +1 on the addition of at least 1 "User" bank to store custom presets. Extra points if the bank name is renamable!

Re: Firmware update feature requests/bugs
« Reply #22 on: October 06, 2022, 12:21:20 PM »
In evaluating the OB-X8, an important aspect of having it as a full keyboard rather than just a module is its ability to act as a master controller. I have found the arpeggiator to be rather quirky in this regard. If I set the OB-X8 to control any other synth with the arpeggiator engaged, the notes on the receiving synth will be triggered by the arp, but also held to ring out as if the chord is both sustained and arpeggiated.  Itís as if the voice allocation of the OB-X8 is using the additional voices to sustain over MIDI to the other synths being controlled.  I tried switching to Unison to see if that changed it, but it only made it inoperable.  Also, Unison mode in the OB-X8 does not work right with the arpeggiator. Bottom line is the Arpeggiator needs an overhaul on how it handles MIDI. And subdivisions and tempo display would be highly useful as well. I compared the arp functionality to how a Prophet 6 handles controlling other synths via MIDI and the arp works as it should - no sustained notes and unison works just fine as well.  Lovely instrument, the OB-X8, just needs a few tweaks!

Re: Firmware update feature requests/bugs
« Reply #23 on: October 11, 2022, 08:48:18 AM »
Two bugs to address:

-there is a volume discrepancy of about 1 dB between the voice cards, apparently this is know and being worked on.

-also, I am getting some undesirable oscillator phase locking/syncing occasionally (on voices where oscs are basically in perfect unison). It's easy to "break" with the slightest amount of detune so I wonder if there is a way to set a global minimum detune value to keep from happening. It's not something that ever happened on the old OBs and shouldn't here.

Re: Firmware update feature requests/bugs
« Reply #24 on: October 24, 2022, 04:07:11 AM »
As people said before I wish for more shortcuts and more use of the screen when you adjust knobs without Page 2.

Also wish showing ADSR graphics when you adjust filter/volume.

Would be nice to have a oscilloskop too.

When in Double/Split mode I wish you could save them without messing with the originals. I wish I could just hear one patch at a time pushing Lower/Upper at ones so one light up. So I can adjust the volume etc. When I want to hear both together I activate both. This way I can hear and adjust the two patches perfectly.

Wish for a little icon that indicates where the knob position was when you adjust for example the filter. This would be great together with showing filter on the screen when adjusting it without Page 2.

Also wish, as stated before, a user bank. And easier/faster way to edit names. Using two knobs works but is tidesome.

drxcm

Re: Firmware update feature requests/bugs
« Reply #25 on: November 12, 2022, 01:57:11 PM »
OSC1 and OSC2 Buttons, can these be set to act as "if held down, and Freq knob turned while holding" - Freq knob then acts as Osc1 or Osc2 Gain Knob depending on which one we hold?

This, and add the Noise button to that as well - hold the desired button, change the freq pot = levels for Osc1/Osc2/Noise into the filter

There are a lot of unused panel switches and a few pots on Panel mode for Page2 that could be utilised.

Agree with all the other suggestions in this thread too - especially some indicator in the screen for a panel control being adjusted, this would be useful

Re: Firmware update feature requests/bugs
« Reply #26 on: November 13, 2022, 01:36:19 PM »
Arpeggiator doesn't have clock divider when receiving external clock. I would think the Rate dial should be a good solution for this.

Re: Firmware update feature requests/bugs
« Reply #27 on: November 15, 2022, 09:38:46 AM »
Feature Request.

Since the envelopes are all digital, would it be possible to incorporate the following options in Page two.

Feature Name: Envelope Mod and Envelope Delay. Option available for both Filter (Filter Env. Mod) and Volume (Volume Env. Mod), the filter being the priority as it feeds to pitch as well. Filter Env. Delay and Volume Env. Delay are self-explanatory.

Options for Envelope Mod:
Normal: Current implementation of envelopes.
Invert: Current implementation of envelopes but inverted.
Repeat on Delay: After Delay reaches the Sustain level, it retriggers the envelopes. Runs as long as the key is held.

The envelope type will still affect curves. The envelope Mod would open up new sonic possibilities. It could be used to add a polyphonic LFO effect. While not an original OB series feature, it could be viewed as an OB-X8 feature that makes it an even more modern OB.

I know this is asking for more menu diving. However, I think it would be worth it.

Re: Firmware update feature requests/bugs
« Reply #28 on: November 23, 2022, 05:21:51 PM »
I've found two bugs, and have reported both to Focusrite/Sequential/Oberheim, but it was suggested that I mention them here as well.

1. You can outrun the pitch bend paddle if you're trying to do Minneapolis-style bends (works fine over MIDI though).
https://youtu.be/dTKuNaySowo

2. In either split or double mode, if you transpose either layer, the VCOs get transposed but not the filter cutoff. The Xa transposes both the VCO and the VCF as expected (perhaps someone can verify that the OB-8 does both as well)
https://youtu.be/5GxihlA4r1w

I would love to see a matched color label set for adding at least the old Page 2 params to the front panel

Re: Firmware update feature requests/bugs
« Reply #29 on: December 04, 2022, 06:11:11 PM »
This sort of thing wouldn't happen in the eighties because the software was stored on hardware ROM chips, and it would have been extremely costly for a company to have the units sent back to replace those ROM chips with updated software.

But nowadays, even on a synth at this high price point, programmers just don't test everything as thoroughly because they're lazy and rely on customers to do their testing for them, and the fact that a firmware update is easily done by USB with a file.

You pay a high premium but still, you have to work for them for free as beta testers.
I know, it has happened to me with my Prophet REV2 and OB6, taking close to 2 years for all the major bugs to be ironed out.  ::)
Minimoog D (vintage), OB6 (Desktop), Oberheim Matrix-6 (MIDI Controller), Prophet REV2-16, DeepMind 12, VC340

LPF83

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Re: Firmware update feature requests/bugs
« Reply #30 on: December 04, 2022, 07:33:58 PM »
This sort of thing wouldn't happen in the eighties because the software was stored on hardware ROM chips, and it would have been extremely costly for a company to have the units sent back to replace those ROM chips with updated software.

But nowadays, even on a synth at this high price point, programmers just don't test everything as thoroughly because they're lazy and rely on customers to do their testing for them, and the fact that a firmware update is easily done by USB with a file.

But at the same time, in the 1980s the programmers wouldn't have to deal with the incessant expectations of random customers that the exact feature that THEY want should take R&D priority over everything else.. Because it was shipped on ROM chips, you buy what you buy and then youre stuck with it.

That's technological "progress" I suppose.  There's a trade-off of the additional QA investment of trying to get things as perfect as possible before burning to chip...testing is not as thorough but we now have the the bonus of additional (and very useful) features being added to the synth, long after it ships.  And Sequential has delivered nicely in this regard.

The Oberheim OB-X original MSRP was $4,600 USD.  That's over $21,000 USD in today's money.

I think many people would argue that the tradeoffs we've made in the name of tech progress are worthwhile.

Besides it's not like the old chips didn't have bugs, even with lots of expensive QA investment.  All of those synths had plenty of bugs.
Prophet 10, Prophet 6, OB-6, Prophet 12m, Prophet Rev2-16, Toraiz AS-1, Pro 2, Virus TI2, Moog SlimPhatty, Hydrasynth desktop, Korg Minilogue XDm, Roland JP-8080, Roland System-8, Roland SPD-SX SE / Octapad, Maschine, Cubase

Re: Firmware update feature requests/bugs
« Reply #31 on: December 04, 2022, 07:48:13 PM »
But at the same time, in the 1980s the programmers wouldn't have to deal with the incessant expectations of random customers that the exact feature that THEY want should take R&D priority over everything else.. Because it was shipped on ROM chips, you buy what you buy and then youre stuck with it.

That's technological "progress" I suppose.  There's a trade-off of the additional QA investment of trying to get things as perfect as possible before burning to chip...testing is not as thorough but we now have the the bonus of additional (and very useful) features being added to the synth, long after it ships.  And Sequential has delivered nicely in this regard.

The Oberheim OB-X original MSRP was $4,600 USD.  That's over $21,000 USD in today's money.

I think many people would argue that the tradeoffs we've made in the name of tech progress are worthwhile.

Besides it's not like the old chips didn't have bugs, even with lots of expensive QA investment.  All of those synths had plenty of bugs.

You've got a point about the bonus of adding features whilst correcting bugs.

As for old machines having bugs, I don't know of any polysynth from any company back in the eighties that would have had those two particular bugs demonstrated by eframp on the OBX8 earlier.
Minimoog D (vintage), OB6 (Desktop), Oberheim Matrix-6 (MIDI Controller), Prophet REV2-16, DeepMind 12, VC340

LPF83

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Re: Firmware update feature requests/bugs
« Reply #32 on: December 05, 2022, 05:00:31 AM »
You've got a point about the bonus of adding features whilst correcting bugs.

As for old machines having bugs, I don't know of any polysynth from any company back in the eighties that would have had those two particular bugs demonstrated by eframp on the OBX8 earlier.

Apparently you never played or owned an Ensoniq VFX, it was a mess of similar bugs. 

Many popular polysynths from the 80s didn't even have MIDI or multi-timbrality, thus wouldn't have anywhere near the implementation complexity that such a feature-rich synth like the OB-X8 has.

I don't think it's a reasonable basis of comparison to look for the presence of specific bugs in specific vintage synths... the point is they had bugs....  plenty of them; and it's largely irrelevant whether they were tuning bugs or the equivalent of bugs being discussed on these forums.  If anyone needs evidence of this, there are lots of various vintage clips on Youtube of popular artists complaining about the state of reliability of 1980's synthesizers, and there are plenty of clips showing the bugs occurring in the middle of a live act.
Prophet 10, Prophet 6, OB-6, Prophet 12m, Prophet Rev2-16, Toraiz AS-1, Pro 2, Virus TI2, Moog SlimPhatty, Hydrasynth desktop, Korg Minilogue XDm, Roland JP-8080, Roland System-8, Roland SPD-SX SE / Octapad, Maschine, Cubase

Re: Firmware update feature requests/bugs
« Reply #33 on: December 05, 2022, 10:45:35 AM »
I still own a few classic synths from the eighties, Ensoniq SQ-80, Korg DW8000, Oberheim Matrix-6, and none of them have any bugs, and all of them have MIDI. The SQ-80 is a very complex machine, essentially a workstation, with a fabulous user interface and no bugs. I recently bought a drum machine from Roland, the TR-8S, and there are no bugs in that machine either, and it's a pretty powerful one too. There might be some minor ones that I didn't see, but certainly no major ones like the ones described by eframp. I still maintain that today's programmers are lazy, either that or plainly incompetent.

I clearly remember how long it took DSI to identify and correct a major bug in the digital encoder reading routine on the REV2, that would result in values jumping around randomly when turning them. They went so far as to send me a complete board replacement before realizing that their software was faulty, to begin with about six months later!
Minimoog D (vintage), OB6 (Desktop), Oberheim Matrix-6 (MIDI Controller), Prophet REV2-16, DeepMind 12, VC340

Re: Firmware update feature requests/bugs
« Reply #34 on: December 05, 2022, 01:07:44 PM »
I still own a few classic synths from the eighties, Ensoniq SQ-80, Korg DW8000, Oberheim Matrix-6, and none of them have any bugs, and all of them have MIDI. The SQ-80 is a very complex machine, essentially a workstation, with a fabulous user interface and no bugs. I recently bought a drum machine from Roland, the TR-8S, and there are no bugs in that machine either, and it's a pretty powerful one too. There might be some minor ones that I didn't see, but certainly no major ones like the ones described by eframp. I still maintain that today's programmers are lazy, either that or plainly incompetent.

I clearly remember how long it took DSI to identify and correct a major bug in the digital encoder reading routine on the REV2, that would result in values jumping around randomly when turning them. They went so far as to send me a complete board replacement before realizing that their software was faulty, to begin with about six months later!

To be perfectly fair on the SQ-80 point, that synth had many EPROM OS firmware revisions starting with the original ESQ-1 OS that had quite a few bugs. Even after it got the SQ-80 revision there are multiple OS versions. In those days users were just stuck with it unless they called the company and found out it existed, then paid for a new EPROM OS chip to be mailed to them to install. It's definitely a misrepresentation to say that the SQ-80 appeared out of nowhere as a completely new product with perfect day 1 software.
« Last Edit: December 05, 2022, 01:09:25 PM by deflep44 »

Re: Firmware update feature requests/bugs
« Reply #35 on: December 05, 2022, 10:42:39 PM »
To be perfectly fair on the SQ-80 point, that synth had many EPROM OS firmware revisions starting with the original ESQ-1 OS that had quite a few bugs...

Name one...
Minimoog D (vintage), OB6 (Desktop), Oberheim Matrix-6 (MIDI Controller), Prophet REV2-16, DeepMind 12, VC340

Re: Firmware update feature requests/bugs
« Reply #36 on: December 06, 2022, 11:26:09 AM »
To be perfectly fair on the SQ-80 point, that synth had many EPROM OS firmware revisions starting with the original ESQ-1 OS that had quite a few bugs...

Name one...

Sigh....  ::) ok -
Most of the firmware and their bugs documented here:
https://soundprogramming.net/synthesizers/ensoniq/ensoniq-esq-1/
The same site also has a bit of info on the SQ-80 firware versions. It looks like even that was up to OS revision 1.8 by end of life, despite jumping off from all the fixes that happened up to ESQ-1 3.5.

Anyway, I'm appreciative of Sequential and their track record of sticking with the recent synths and adding lots of big features the the P5, P6/OB6, Pro3 etc. well after launch. Personally really hoping for something similar to the dot that marks a knobs saved preset value when passing it like on their other synths to appear on the X8. As well as a way to edit both layers simultaneously in double mode.

Re: Firmware update feature requests/bugs
« Reply #37 on: December 06, 2022, 02:04:29 PM »
I wanted to wait a while before doing this, until I had a real feel for the OB-X8. I love it, and overall I think it's the best synth ever made. With that said, this is a list of everything I'd like to see changed about it, in order of urgency/priority. Some of these things may not be possible in firmware, but I'm stating them anyway in case there are future versions. Some have been mentioned by others.

1. Arpeggiator Clock

The biggest frustration for me by far is the lack of functions like those in the CLOCK section of the OB-6. The ability to set a tempo by BPM, and then choose subdivisions against that clock (or an external clock). I would also like to have tempo sync for LFOs, etc, but those are a lower priority. Not having that functionality makes the arpeggiator nearly unusable in a variety of situations. The RATE knob is imprecise, and you can only adjust it to match a tempo by ear. Also, when set to an external clock, there is no ability to choose the subdivision of the arpeggiator. It plays 16th notes only, synced to whatever tempo it's receiving. If this can be changed, I hope it will be done as soon as possible.

2. Arpeggiator HOLD

The way it works now, if you hold down notes with both hands, there is no way to press the hold button. I've ended up using my nose to do it. An option to switch the way this works, to a pre-played behavior, is badly needed.

3. OB-X/a/8 Modes, Pan Settings

Every time I start new program, the first things I adjust are the Filter Type, Square Mode, Envelope Mode, and LFO mode for the different versions of OB, and the Pan settings. Having to do a bunch of scrolling through Page 2 for those settings is very annoying. Ideally, there would be buttons on the panel, in the Control section for Pan Mode, Pan Width, and Stereo/Mono output (from the Global Menu), and in the Programmer section for OB-X/OB-Xa/OB-8 modes (including all of the settings above). Barring that, I think there should be an option added to Page 2, right at the start as the first option, to choose between OB-X/a/8 modes, that would switch the Filter, Squares, Envelopes and LFOs to match the corresponding model. Similarly, the Pan/Stereo settings should be moved close to the start. There should also be panel mode adjustments for those, like the other Page 2 functions on the OB-8.

4. Saved position indicator

This function exists on the Prophet-6/OB-6 and presumably Trigon-6. When you turn a control past the saved point for that patch, a red dot appears on the display. It was a very key addition to those models. I was very surprised this doesn't have something like that, and it should. It seems like it should be very easy.

5. USER Program Bank

It would be really good to have a separate, empty, USER program bank, instead of just having empty patches at the end of each factory bank. That's really inconvenient and disorganized. I would think this could be done easily in firmware.

6. Graphic design

Even though it's superficial, I really wish the OB-X8 had the blue-line graphics that Oberheim products are known for, instead of the earlier, briefly used gray squares of the OB-X. I awaited the release of the OB-X8 more eagerly than any other instrument, and I was extremely surprised and disappointed that it used that design, especially since the better known design was used on the OB-6. If Oberheim/Sequential produced optional replacements for the panel and lever box covers with the blue line design the brand is known for, I would buy them immediately. If they produced an alternate version of the OB-X8 with no changes except the graphic design, I would buy it immediately. If they produced a revision with that design, I would buy it immediately. Having waited this long for this synth to exist, and paid the not-insignificant price for it, it really bothers me that it doesn't look the way I think most people expected it to. I've never thought the gray squares looked good, and as a continuation of the line, it doesn't make sense to go backwards with the design. I really kind of don't like to look at it. Having owned an OB-6, I actually feel like it loses some psychological inspiration by not looking like what I consider a real Oberheim to be.


Aside from those, I agree with most of the suggestions above, but these are the ones that are most urgent to me.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2022, 02:38:40 PM by -AJ- »

Re: Firmware update feature requests/bugs
« Reply #38 on: December 06, 2022, 02:05:13 PM »
To be perfectly fair on the SQ-80 point, that synth had many EPROM OS firmware revisions starting with the original ESQ-1 OS that had quite a few bugs...

Name one...

Sigh....  ::) ok -
Most of the firmware and their bugs documented here:
https://soundprogramming.net/synthesizers/ensoniq/ensoniq-esq-1/
The same site also has a bit of info on the SQ-80 firware versions. It looks like even that was up to OS revision 1.8 by end of life, despite jumping off from all the fixes that happened up to ESQ-1 3.5.

Anyway, I'm appreciative of Sequential and their track record of sticking with the recent synths and adding lots of big features the the P5, P6/OB6, Pro3 etc. well after launch. Personally really hoping for something similar to the dot that marks a knobs saved preset value when passing it like on their other synths to appear on the X8. As well as a way to edit both layers simultaneously in double mode.

This discussion should be moved elsewhere.

Re: Firmware update feature requests/bugs
« Reply #39 on: December 08, 2022, 01:48:10 AM »
The manual refers to shortcuts, for setting the oscillator and noise levels, that do not seem to be implemented:

Quote
Osc 1 Level: The Osc 1 level control allows you to set the specific volume level for Oscillator 1 when the osc 1 panel switch in the Filter section is engaged.

Osc 2 Level: The Osc 2 level control allows you to set the specific volume level for Oscillator 2 when the osc 2 panel switch in the Filter section is engaged.

Noise Level: Similar to the Osc 1 and 2 Level parameters, this allows you to set the level of noise when the noise switch is engaged.

With Page 2 engaged, pressing these switches either turns the corresponding oscillator/noise on/off (when the Page 2 Edit Mode is Display Only) or jumps to Portamento settings (when the Page 2 Edit Mode is Panel + Display). Holding down either of these switches + the Page 2 button does nothing either.

I'm on OS 1.0.0.3.
« Last Edit: December 08, 2022, 02:06:16 AM by Kim Sand »