3rd Wave

[LPF83]

The "bad" are fixable: Selecting multiparts (2,3, or 4) so as to edit all parts simultaneously is difficult.   Maybe its just the desktop, but I have a hard time getting 2 or more to flash in unison.  I'm hoping a OS fix will address this. There a couple of small bugs which again, I assume OS updates will fix.  If you are working on a patch and making edits to it, its hard to go back to patch same number to save it w/o reverting back to the program screen, which then defaults you back to default patch.  This is a workflow problem that should be fixed.   Sequencer selection for multi parts is a little odd.  Already talked to their support crew and they recognized that and plan on updating it.

The good:  Customer service for the questions I had has been fantastic and quick.  I love the waveform import to hardware made so easy.  Already have cymbal and banjo sounds imported      The quality of sound is superior grade, I think it takes the cake to be honest.     Right there with UDOs6 for like binural type sound if you wish to set it multiparts panned L/R. The analog waves with some drift set can get you into OB6 realm.    I'm a little slow on picking up on the 2 filter types filters in being series order, would rather had a parallel option like on Pro2.    Sequencer can do real-time recording which -alleluia!     

As for a side by side, and your P12 example,  I really haven't tried that yet.  The P12 can make so many wave forms from mutating the few that are onboard.  I always liked how the P12 how it could go really deep on the lower notes.  This seems to have a bottomless pit for low notes still being discernable.    But to me the 3rd wave just a different beast for a different purpose.  The only instrument I'm replacing due to this purchase is the Summit, which was nice, but redundant, and really offered nothing sonically unique to what I already had.  Though, I will miss the tunable scales.  I had several that I liked having in there Baroque/African/Chinese.  Anyway...whereas my other DSI stuff (and other makes as well)  each offer a unique tone or ability to the synth lineup I use.   Speaking of comparisons, the first thing I thought of when I flicked on the 3rd wave and started messing around was that I was able to get into that PEK territory more than anything else I've owned.   I hope to do a youtube soon.

Thank you for the thoughts!  Since you mentioned simultaneous part editing, I'm curious whether multiple oscillators be selected simultanously by holding buttons?

[LPF83]

My module should be here in a few days, I've seen/heard enough on Youtube to believe that I have multiple use cases this module will fit nicely into, and got a deal I couldn't refuse. 

Any "wish I'd known that in the first hour!" sort of tips appreciated!

[Soundquest]

LPF3,   Congrats.  I'm sure you'll like it.  By the way...about the multiselect buttons.  I emailed Groove support and they said that there is a downloadable beta1.6 version more recent than the existing 1.6OS you module will likely come with.   That has a fix that allows you to use the mode key as a shift...then select any parts you want to update simultaneously.  I plan to update it tomorrow.   

I got tangled up for hours the other day comparing 3rdwave's analog waveforms to the Hydrasynth and OB6, comparing, contrasting.  When all was said and done, not sure I accomplished much.  I mean w/o filters engaged you can hear differences.  Actually the hydrasynth seemed to have the strongest "spectra", but once filters come to play we're back to filter comparisons, not oscillators so much.   I was able to get all 3 of them to sound pretty close using a saw wave slightly filtered.   

[LPF83]

LPF3,   Congrats.  I'm sure you'll like it.  By the way...about the multiselect buttons.  I emailed Groove support and they said that there is a downloadable beta1.6 version more recent than the existing 1.6OS you module will likely come with.   That has a fix that allows you to use the mode key as a shift...then select any parts you want to update simultaneously.  I plan to update it tomorrow.   

I got tangled up for hours the other day comparing 3rdwave's analog waveforms to the Hydrasynth and OB6, comparing, contrasting.  When all was said and done, not sure I accomplished much.  I mean w/o filters engaged you can hear differences.  Actually the hydrasynth seemed to have the strongest "spectra", but once filters come to play we're back to filter comparisons, not oscillators so much.   I was able to get all 3 of them to sound pretty close using a saw wave slightly filtered.

Interesting about the mode button!

One of my strongest interests in the 3W is a particular use cases that involves the 24 voices/4 parts aspect, and the VA synthesis, so the wavetable/PPG sounds etc are more of an icing on the cake thing to me as odd as that might seem.  Also since it can read Serum wavetables, I'm interested to try that to see how well it works out.  Serum is a nice wavetable plugin, but the main things about it I wasn't fond of (just the fact that its a plug in and not hardware, uses lots of CPU to sound impressive etc) seem potentially solved with running those wavetables through the 2140 filter.  I wonder if this feature is as good as it sounds or is just a box-ticking sales boost feature.  I'm also curious to see what new features they may add, it seems to be a very powerful synth with a lot of potential.. but from what I've heard, I think I will be happy with it even with the functionality it has today.

[LPF83]

Sorry if this has already been posted elsewhere, it's not a new video but I think there are lots of very interesting insights into this synth in this interview with Bob Coover and Mark Wilcox.  It's a long video, but there is lots of good stuff to learn here about the design/creation process of this synth.  This is a labor of love for these guys, which means things don't happen overnight or impulsively, the synth was in development for a long time, and they all have good day jobs and thus no "corporate hustle incentive" to throw XYZ feature in done with bugs then abandon, rinse and repeat.  There is a genuine passion for synths and an amazing pedigree behind this product.  I also think it has the potential to have interesting features added to the current model without pressure to withhold features for a sequel.  I've heard nothing but great things about the synth and the guys behind it and can't wait to hear how mine sounds when it arrives.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2c8r0Y1mCiA&t=39s

[LPF83]

Now that I own this module and have had some time with it, I'm looking back on some of the prior reluctance/doubts I posted in the first few pages of thread, and I'm now realizing I should probably not speculate on the value of an instrument I haven't heard in person.

This is a special synth and well worth the money. 

More later...

[LPF83]

The "bad" are fixable: Selecting multiparts (2,3, or 4) so as to edit all parts simultaneously is difficult.   Maybe its just the desktop, but I have a hard time getting 2 or more to flash in unison.

I'm running the latest beta as of today (1.6e) and this was still fiddly for me until I the got the hang of the intended workflow (i.e. first make sure the parts are active, then double tap both parts simultanously).  They may have relaxed the timing required for the double tap, but it seems to work well enough once I realized what I'm supposed to do..It's different to be sure, I guess that's the requirement of a synth with so many voices and parts.

I gave it a little practice so I could do the double-tap-dance faster with 2-3 parts, as I think this is a key aspect of how I will use this synth (multi-editing 3 parts actually may be easier on the desktop due to tight proximity between fingers 1+2+thumb.. can't confirm that as I haven't tried keyboard).

Just to test my dexterity I tried double tapping 4 buttons at once with one hand, and then realized I was probably creating unrealistic goals for myself ....   Using two hands though, it's perfectly doable, at least with beta 1.6e

[Soundquest]

I say don't bother , just use the mode button as a shift for the selects.

[LPF83]

I say don't bother , just use the mode button as a shift for the selects.

On my unit the mode button doesn't seem to enable multiple parts for editing, only double tap.

[Soundquest]

Groove actually sent me a link via email to a special version of 1.6 that allows this feature.   They are probably waiting to add a few more bug fixes before posting that version on their website.   I called it "downloadable" earlier by mistake.  Shoot them an email.   Just activate the layers you want, then mode/ then tap each (they all stick correctly).

[LPF83]

Groove actually sent me a link via email to a special version of 1.6 that allows this feature.   They are probably waiting to add a few more bug fixes before posting that version on their website.   I called it "downloadable" earlier by mistake.  Shoot them an email.   Just activate the layers you want, then mode/ then tap each (they all stick correctly).

Thanks, it's all good though... I've gotten used to the double tap thing for now -- the only time it was an issue was before I cracked open the manual and understood how it worked.  I might like the Mode button method once the downloadable release comes out, but I'm not in any hurry for that one feature.

Have you heard Scott McAuley's new soundset he just released?  Worth listening to even if you're not interested in other's sound design.  When I saw the video with the Howard Jones "What Is Love" program I thought about how this synth does a nice Jupiter 8 if it is instructed to do so.

Link to that part of the vid here:  https://youtu.be/PSRfFl-_F28?t=966 

[Soundquest]

Groove actually sent me a link via email to a special version of 1.6 that allows this feature.   They are probably waiting to add a few more bug fixes before posting that version on their website.   I called it "downloadable" earlier by mistake.  Shoot them an email.   Just activate the layers you want, then mode/ then tap each (they all stick correctly).

Thanks, it's all good though... I've gotten used to the double tap thing for now -- the only time it was an issue was before I cracked open the manual and understood how it worked.  I might like the Mode button method once the downloadable release comes out, but I'm not in any hurry for that one feature.

Have you heard Scott McAuley's new soundset he just released?  Worth listening to even if you're not interested in other's sound design.  When I saw the video with the Howard Jones "What Is Love" program I thought about how this synth does a nice Jupiter 8 if it is instructed to do so.

Link to that part of the vid here:  https://youtu.be/PSRfFl-_F28?t=966

LPF83,  I sure have.  I like listening to all his synth soundset designs.  He presents the various patches so well.  So far I did download MilesAway's  set into bank 1.  I felt many of his were just outright pretty, not overly complex.  I'm putting my own creations or modified patches into bank 5.   I downloaded some waveforms from a church pipe organ.  I used "high pipes" on osc 1, then a lower deep pipes on osc 2.  Split the patch  to parts 1 and 2 as stereo.   After a lot of fine tuning (for what part of the wave forms was best) and adding a little reverb and such, I got the whole cathedral thing going on.  Even added some monk voices to part 3       I only had one other "good" church pipe organ in my collection, and that was from the factory  program on the P12- which is actually quite impressive.

[LPF83]

Groove actually sent me a link via email to a special version of 1.6 that allows this feature.   They are probably waiting to add a few more bug fixes before posting that version on their website.   I called it "downloadable" earlier by mistake.  Shoot them an email.   Just activate the layers you want, then mode/ then tap each (they all stick correctly).

Thanks, it's all good though... I've gotten used to the double tap thing for now -- the only time it was an issue was before I cracked open the manual and understood how it worked.  I might like the Mode button method once the downloadable release comes out, but I'm not in any hurry for that one feature.

Have you heard Scott McAuley's new soundset he just released?  Worth listening to even if you're not interested in other's sound design.  When I saw the video with the Howard Jones "What Is Love" program I thought about how this synth does a nice Jupiter 8 if it is instructed to do so.

Link to that part of the vid here:  https://youtu.be/PSRfFl-_F28?t=966

LPF83,  I sure have.  I like listening to all his synth soundset designs.  He presents the various patches so well.  So far I did download MilesAway's  set into bank 1.  I felt many of his were just outright pretty, not overly complex.  I'm putting my own creations or modified patches into bank 5.   I downloaded some waveforms from a church pipe organ.  I used "high pipes" on osc 1, then a lower deep pipes on osc 2.  Split the patch  to parts 1 and 2 as stereo.   After a lot of fine tuning (for what part of the wave forms was best) and adding a little reverb and such, I got the whole cathedral thing going on.  Even added some monk voices to part 3       I only had one other "good" church pipe organ in my collection, and that was from the factory  program on the P12- which is actually quite impressive.

I've been having great fun with the binaural aspect as well, experimenting with different ways to vary the patch in the L and R channels -- it's not that I don't have other synths that can do this (P12, Rev2 etc), it just seems like this synth begs to be used that way.

I agree with something SM says in his YT description -- I do find myself investing more time in patch design on this synth..  Not because it's more difficult (in fact I'd say it's one of the easiest to program synths I've ever used), but because sound design presents us with so many possibilities that I find myself spending more time trying this or that.

Regarding patch storage, I do wish there were enough room for 5 user banks while still preserving the 5 factory banks... but I'm not complaining because 500 patches total is a reasonable amount, and swapping around is easy via USB.

[Soundquest]

A little bit related to 3rd wave. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIetUzygYEU

[LPF83]

Cool!

Not sure if you're aware, but firmware version 1.7b has been released.  The full list of fixes is here:

https://www.groovesynthesis.com/downloads/3WAVE/readme/readme_1_7.txt

[Soundquest]

I was not aware.  thanks LPF83

[loweaddison]

Cool!

Not sure if you're aware, but firmware version 1.7b has been released.  The full list of fixes is here:

https://www.groovesynthesis.com/downloads/3WAVE/readme/readme_1_7.txt dinosaur game

Firmware 0.1.7b is out with a number of fixes. Get it here!

[LPF83]

One thing I've found on the 3rd wave that is an absolute must is an expression pedal...  The maddening amount of things you can assign it to really matters on this synth -- and yes you can have other things modulate all of that, but by assigning subtle amounts (and I mean only values between 1 and 6 for some destinations), the results can really be incredible.  Yes other synths do this but there's something about the signal path combined with the versatility of this synth and the absurd mod matrix possibilities that makes me want to always map the pedal.

[Soundquest]

One thing I've found on the 3rd wave that is an absolute must is an expression pedal...  The maddening amount of things you can assign it to really matters on this synth -- and yes you can have other things modulate all of that, but by assigning subtle amounts (and I mean only values between 1 and 6 for some destinations), the results can really be incredible.  Yes other synths do this but there's something about the signal path combined with the versatility of this synth and the absurd mod matrix possibilities that makes me want to always map the pedal.

I have one hooked up but haven't even used it yet.  Still happily distracted with everything else on it.   

By the way LPF83, have you noticed any  clicking upon attack on the analogue wave forms?  I know that's common on analogue instruments, which easily fixed by backing off of the attack on the envelopes, but I seem to need to back off by 11 "units" before the clicking sound goes away.  I also noticed this clicking on some waveforms I had recorded and entered into the user waveform slots, but I just assumed that was part of some artifact in my waveforms.

[LPF83]

By the way LPF83, have you noticed any  clicking upon attack on the analogue wave forms?  I know that's common on analogue instruments, which easily fixed by backing off of the attack on the envelopes, but I seem to need to back off by 11 "units" before the clicking sound goes away.  I also noticed this clicking on some waveforms I had recorded and entered into the user waveform slots, but I just assumed that was part of some artifact in my waveforms.

Yes, it definitely seems clicky on something like a sine wave with attack to 0..  clicks and pops of various origin seem to be present on most of my synths, so I think I've just developed a habit of tweaking the clicks away and / or working around them.
On the 3rd Wave, it almost seems as if the envelope attack at 0 is faster than most synths, and that the intention is to rarely have need for filter and amp attack at 0.  Even the init program starts the filter attack out at 34, which I found interesting.
Also you may have noticed clicking is usually worse when you have the oscillators set to free running mode.  To paste a quote from the manual that may be helpful:

"Second, in the default mode, the 3rd Wave’s virtual analog oscillators
always start at zero. But in free-running mode, the oscillators could
start at any point in their phase position. In some cases, depending on
the phase position, this can cause a click at the beginning of a note. It is
noticeable mostly if you are using a sine wave, and less noticeable when
you are using a sawtooth or square wave. If you want to avoid a potential
click, try use setting the Amp Envelope’s attack parameter to +20 or
higher."

So, if you're getting acceptable results with the amp attack around +11, I think you're doing good.  For me I find I need to go up to at least +16 or so before there's no longer a noticable click on just a sine wave played solo.