Tempest Main 1.5.0.2 and Voice 1.5 - Bug Reports

[sofine]

As stated it was a bug that was removed

Hello all and thanks for your hard work to make Tempest even better! The changes are complex and amazing.

However, we are still missing a working Latch function on Roll set as FX. This behaviour is possible in previous OS by switching to Sounds Mode while rolling in Beats/Mutes. This is crucial to perform live along the rolling loop. If there's any way to achieve it now, please let me know, otherwise I'm reluctantly heading back again to the old OS. I'd be truly grateful for reimplementing this feature, fingers crossed!

cheers!
pawel

It would be very useful to allow both behaviours - perhaps a global config setting, if it is possible.

[Yorgos Arabatzis]

Ye would like that too ^

[Bras]

As stated it was a bug that was removed

Hello all and thanks for your hard work to make Tempest even better! The changes are complex and amazing.

However, we are still missing a working Latch function on Roll set as FX. This behaviour is possible in previous OS by switching to Sounds Mode while rolling in Beats/Mutes. This is crucial to perform live along the rolling loop. If there's any way to achieve it now, please let me know, otherwise I'm reluctantly heading back again to the old OS. I'd be truly grateful for reimplementing this feature, fingers crossed!

cheers!
pawel

It would be very useful to allow both behaviours - perhaps a global config setting, if it is possible.

To make it clearer - it is a bug if you can't set a latch on FX Slider set to Roll. Fixing it would do miracles!

[soidthezoid]

Hi Roger.

Please tell me that the Beat Roll will swing before DSI checks out of this for another year or two.

And, please tell me that things left unfinished will not take another year or two to be revisited. Please, please, please. I just love this machine so much and want it wrapped up!

Thanks again for recommitting to this.

I'm afraid I can't give you an exact date for adding swing to Beat Roll. To be honest, when I initially read it on the petition, I didn't even think of Beat Roll because it said "Roll/Arp", but that's my error. Regarding your second question, in the short term, fixes to the fixes will be prompt so we can get this official update out. For the future, yes Tempest bugs will continue to be fixed in a timely manner, and rest assured that I will continue to push for that. That said, given that all but a few petition bugs were addressed plus 16 additional bugs were fixed that weren't on the petition, I think it's fair to let DSI's other products get some love for the moment, given that work on them languished while so much of the focus was on Tempest. To be clear, don't read into this that I'm hinting that Tempest updates will be abandoned or further updates will take 2 years because that's not true.

On a related topic, I'm know I'm biased but it's pretty amazing to me that Tempest has so very many more features and musically-useful capabilities than any other analog drum machine on the market, and at this point I think that Tempest bugs are minor compared to those capabilities and compared to other buggy complex hardware sequencing products like the current MPCs, which don't have the enormous complexity of a 9-computer analog voice system. And I'm particularly proud of the fact that among all the bugs mentioned, not one of them corrupts your music data because that was fundamental to the design from the start. Plus I'm proud of the fact that quite a large number of pros are making music with Tempest daily.

So in summary, yes there are still some bugs, yes they're important to us, yes we'll zap them, and yes I'll continue to make sure we do.

Hi Roger,

Regarding the fixes, which you assure us will be implemented before the next official OS release, will the MIDI sync issues be addressed?  The MIDI sync is, in my opinion, fundamental to the Tempest's operation & has been causing me no end of issues!

Cheers, J

[muleskinner]

Hi,

I have (regretably) upgraded to the latest beta because I understood it was pretty stable and I use the Tempest alot and want to contribute to its development. More or less right away I have run into what seems like a *horrible* bug which is really impacting my workflow...

- When 'remote pad play' is set to 'beats' the Tempest switches beat even when in '16 Sounds' mode. I've tried restarting and the same thing happens. Switch 'remote pad play' mode back to 'sounds' and the problem doesn't occur. This could well make this beta unuseable for me.   

Also sync when switching beats via 'remote pad play' seems to be intermittently awful if 'pad hold' is switched on. It's like the whole beat starts a beat late or something. I can work round this but it never used to be a problem on the last official firmware.

Trying to stay positive with this machine because I love so much about it but this really seems like one step forward two steps back.

* edit *

OK - on further investigation this problem is intermittent. I'm not sure exactly what causes it but I seem to be able to get the Tempest to enter this buggy state reliably by switching beats remotely with 'pad hold' on. If I do this and then stop the sequencer the T enters this buggy state whereby hitting a pad in '16 sounds' mode also changes the beat. If I switch 'pad hold' off and restart the sequencer everything goes back to working as it should.

Also I notice that 'pad hold' seems to turn itself off if you switch from '16 beats' mode to '16 sounds' and back which I'm pretty sure shouldn't happen and didn't happen in v.1.4.

[grunes]

MacOS 10.12
SysEx Librarian 1.3.1
Tempest OS 1.4.3.2b
Voice OS 1.5

Hi, first off thank you Roger, Dave and Team for progressing updates. I myself have come across this problem:

After updating to the latest Beta 1.4.3.2b if I edit a project and then attempt the following directly from RAM Save/Load: 7. Export Project over MIDI  I get a FREEZE

Tempest Reports:

“Exporting Project [Name] over MIDI…
Exporting Project Params… Done
Exporting Project [Beat x]…”
[FREEZE]

However, I can save the Project to flash and use Tempest Save/Load: 8. Export File over MIDI (Sound/Beat/Project) successfully

Have downloaded and installed the update twice to ensure no download errors.

[bobbyquine]

Hi, first post on the new forum. Thank you to ALL for getting this far, but can I please add my passionate (!) encouragement to all at DSI to keep pushing this through? I nearly sold the T out of despair, until I found out almost 3 months late that there has been progress. I think the new beta could be better advertised on the old forum, I didn't even know that anything was going on!!

Anyway.....

I'd like to report a bug that hasn't yet been acknowledged as far as I know, and that's the external control of bank B mutes. Not the most popular topic, I'm sure, but it's a bug nonetheless, one that is important to me.

Could someone please confirm? Set external midi pad control to mutes, set pad to note assignments chromatically, and play a scale on a midi keyboard. Bank A is fine, the mutings follow exactly, but bank B then becomes totally random.

[John the Savage]

I think the new beta could be better advertised on the old forum, I didn't even know that anything was going on!!

http://dsiforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=13746&p=75094#p75094

I'd like to report a bug that hasn't yet been acknowledged as far as I know, and that's the external control of bank B mutes. Not the most popular topic, I'm sure, but it's a bug nonetheless, one that is important to me.

Could someone please confirm? Set external midi pad control to mutes, set pad to note assignments chromatically, and play a scale on a midi keyboard. Bank A is fine, the mutings follow exactly, but bank B then becomes totally random.

I will add this bug to the list after it has been tested and confirmed here.  Both myself and Roger Linn are extremely busy with other projects right now, so it may take a week or so, but one of us will let you know what we find.  Thanks for your participation, Bobby; it's much appreciated.

Cheers!

[Stoss]

Compressor Envelope Amount goes from -64 to +127. Is this by design or is it a bug?

[Roger_Linn]

Compressor Envelope Amount goes from -64 to +127. Is this by design or is it a bug?

Yes, that's a bug. Thank you.
By the way, sorry to all for being away for a while. My company is only me, and LinnStrument, AdrenaLinn and my company's other work got behind while I was focusing on Tempest. It's like playing Whack-a-Mole.  

[John the Savage]

Compressor Envelope Amount goes from -64 to +127. Is this by design or is it a bug?

Hmm... In my mind's eye, I feel like that was a "fix" meant to rein-in some unruly compressor behavior once upon a time, but I found this in the change-log from that era:

Main OS 1.3.3.1
Fixed bug: Compressor Env Amount displayed as -64 to 190 incorrectly, now displayed as -127 to 127.

So now I just don't know, but I'll ask Chris about it.  Thanks, Stoss.

Cheers!

*Edit: Ah, and as I post this Roger Linn comes to the rescue (grin).  Thanks, Roger.

[Roger_Linn]

Hi, first post on the new forum. Thank you to ALL for getting this far, but can I please add my passionate (!) encouragement to all at DSI to keep pushing this through? I nearly sold the T out of despair, until I found out almost 3 months late that there has been progress. I think the new beta could be better advertised on the old forum, I didn't even know that anything was going on!!

Sorry, Bobby. While I was focusing on Tempest over the past months, my work on LinnStrument, AdrenaLinn and my other company stuff languished, and I'm the whole company. But I'm now catching up in order to get this update finished and released.

Anyway.....

I'd like to report a bug that hasn't yet been acknowledged as far as I know, and that's the external control of bank B mutes. Not the most popular topic, I'm sure, but it's a bug nonetheless, one that is important to me.

Could someone please confirm? Set external midi pad control to mutes, set pad to note assignments chromatically, and play a scale on a midi keyboard. Bank A is fine, the mutings follow exactly, but bank B then becomes totally random.

Yes, I've just confirmed that's a bug and I've added it to the DSI bug list. The bug is that on the System > MIDI Remote Pad Play screen and Pad To Note Mode is set to Mutes only, if a note number is received that is one of the Bank B assignments on that page, it is treated as the Bank A assignment of the same number. For example, if Pad B1 is assigned to note# 80 and Pad A1 is assigned to note# 69, sending Tempest note#80 will toggle the mute of pad A1.  Thank you for finding this bug.

[Roger_Linn]

MacOS 10.12
SysEx Librarian 1.3.1
Tempest OS 1.4.3.2b
Voice OS 1.5

After updating to the latest Beta 1.4.3.2b if I edit a project and then attempt the following directly from RAM Save/Load: 7. Export Project over MIDI  I get a FREEZE

Tempest Reports:

“Exporting Project [Name] over MIDI…
Exporting Project Params… Done
Exporting Project [Beat x]…”
[FREEZE]

Thanks, Grunes. I can't get the same problem to occur here. Can you get it to happen while exporting one of the stock Tempest projects?

[Roger_Linn]

I have run into what seems like a *horrible* bug which is really impacting my workflow...

- When 'remote pad play' is set to 'beats' the Tempest switches beat even when in '16 Sounds' mode. I've tried restarting and the same thing happens. Switch 'remote pad play' mode back to 'sounds' and the problem doesn't occur. This could well make this beta unuseable for me.   

Yes, that's how it is supposed to operate and how it's operated from the start. If you set Pad To Note Mode to Beats, incoming MIDI Note On messages will select Beats. I think you may be intending to set Pad To Note Mode to Follow Pad Func, which follows the Pad Function. Hopefully this will be less horrible for you.

Also sync when switching beats via 'remote pad play' seems to be intermittently awful if 'pad hold' is switched on. It's like the whole beat starts a beat late or something. I can work round this but it never used to be a problem on the last official firmware.

When you say the beat starts late, which of the following are you saying?:

1) Tempest is not playing, then you remotely press a key on your external MIDI keyboard to start a beat. Tempest starts playing the beat about one 1/4 note after you press the key.
2) Tempest is playing, then you remotely press a key on your external MIDI keyboard to change to a different beat. Tempest changes to the new beat late, perhaps by one 1/4 note.

If you are saying #2 above, is it possible that you had Beat Quantize set to 1/4 note? If so, this would result is the beat only changing on 1/4 note boundaries. If this is the problem, set Beat Quantize to Off and perhaps it will be less awful for you.

On a positive note, you have found a bug: In the System > MIDI Remote Pad Play screen, set Pad To Note Mode to Beats. Then in the 16 Beats / Pads screen, set Pad Hold (soft key) to On. Now press keys on the remote MIDI keyboard. Notice that pressing the key starts the beat, but releasing the key does not stop the beat. Thank you for finding this bug.

Trying to stay positive with this machine because I love so much about it but this really seems like one step forward two steps back.

Thank you for trying to stay positive.

* edit *

OK - on further investigation this problem is intermittent. I'm not sure exactly what causes it but I seem to be able to get the Tempest to enter this buggy state reliably by switching beats remotely with 'pad hold' on. If I do this and then stop the sequencer the T enters this buggy state whereby hitting a pad in '16 sounds' mode also changes the beat. If I switch 'pad hold' off and restart the sequencer everything goes back to working as it should.

I was unable to reproduce the problem you're describing. If you are able to find a list of actions that if repeated will reproduce the problem, please post them here.

Also I notice that 'pad hold' seems to turn itself off if you switch from '16 beats' mode to '16 sounds' and back which I'm pretty sure shouldn't happen and didn't happen in v.1.4.

Yes, that is correct. Pad Hold mode is only available while in the 16 Beats / Pads screen. It has always been that way.

[Roger_Linn]

Hi Roger,

Regarding the fixes, which you assure us will be implemented before the next official OS release, will the MIDI sync issues be addressed?  The MIDI sync is, in my opinion, fundamental to the Tempest's operation & has been causing me no end of issues!

Cheers, J

Hi soid-- can you please clarify which MIDI sync bugs you are referring to that are causing you no end of issues?

[Roger_Linn]

To make it clearer - it is a bug if you can't set a latch on FX Slider set to Roll. Fixing it would do miracles!

Thanks, Bras. I'm afraid Latch On was never intended to work when a Beat FX slider is assigned to Beat Roll. To latch a Beat Roll on, the intended method is to toggle the Beat Roll button on.

[grunes]

MacOS 10.12
SysEx Librarian 1.3.1
Tempest OS 1.4.3.2b
Voice OS 1.5

After updating to the latest Beta 1.4.3.2b if I edit a project and then attempt the following directly from RAM Save/Load: 7. Export Project over MIDI  I get a FREEZE

Tempest Reports:

“Exporting Project [Name] over MIDI…
Exporting Project Params… Done
Exporting Project [Beat x]…”
[FREEZE]

Thanks, Grunes. I can't get the same problem to occur here. Can you get it to happen while exporting one of the stock Tempest projects?

Hi Roger, thank you for replying. Yes, I get the same results on stock Tempest projects. I have just switch the Tempest on and loaded the stock Tempest project “Eight Oh Eight’ and attempted Export Project over MIDI the Tempest froze at Exporting project [Beat 3]. I can post the resulting 4Msgs SysEx file if you want. Thanks again for your time.

[muleskinner]

I have run into what seems like a *horrible* bug which is really impacting my workflow...

- When 'remote pad play' is set to 'beats' the Tempest switches beat even when in '16 Sounds' mode. I've tried restarting and the same thing happens. Switch 'remote pad play' mode back to 'sounds' and the problem doesn't occur. This could well make this beta unuseable for me.   

Yes, that's how it is supposed to operate and how it's operated from the start. If you set Pad To Note Mode to Beats, incoming MIDI Note On messages will select Beats. I think you may be intending to set Pad To Note Mode to Follow Pad Func, which follows the Pad Function. Hopefully this will be less horrible for you.

Hi Roger,

Thanks for the reply - I will try and get a reliable repro for the issue.

I don't think you quite understand what I mean by the issue though - I have Pad To Note mode set to 'beats' so that remote control of the pads will change beat. I then set 'local' control mode to 'sounds' so I can jam along or edit sounds as I go. Hitting a (physical) pad is now triggering the appropriate sound as expected but also changing beat! Surely this is not expected behaviour?

As is often the case with these things it hasn't popped up since I first experienced it but I am about to get the Tempest out now... 

[muleskinner]

Also I notice that 'pad hold' seems to turn itself off if you switch from '16 beats' mode to '16 sounds' and back which I'm pretty sure shouldn't happen and didn't happen in v.1.4.

Yes, that is correct. Pad Hold mode is only available while in the 16 Beats / Pads screen. It has always been that way.

To clarify - what I mean by this one is that if you turn 'pad hold' on, switch from '16 Beats' to '16 Sounds' and then back to '16 Beats' then 'pad hold' has turned itself off. I wouldn't have thought this was the intended behaviour - surely it should remain as set by the user? It may have always been this way I don't know, I've only just started using it, seems a bit counter-intuitive to me though.

[bobbyquine]

Sorry, Bobby. While I was focusing on Tempest over the past months, my work on LinnStrument, AdrenaLinn and my other company stuff languished, and I'm the whole company. But I'm now catching up in order to get this update finished and released.

Not apologies necessary Roger, thanks for getting behind this!