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Having difficulty with MIDI clock from DAW

Having difficulty with MIDI clock from DAW
« on: February 09, 2021, 10:02:55 AM »
I usually use a straight USB cable to sync my Sequential synths with but I wanted to try a USB to 5 Pin cable and although the clock is being sent via USB from the DAW, the 5 pin MIDI in on the Sequential gear won't start at all. The sequencers don't activate, arpeggiators don't start. Nothing. What am I doing wrong? I've confirmed that the MIDI clock is being received via 5 pin din and I can see from the FORE cable that's lighting up information is being transmitted but it's just not being registered on the Tempest or Prophet.

jok3r

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Re: Having difficulty with MIDI clock from DAW
« Reply #1 on: February 09, 2021, 01:39:39 PM »
I usually use a straight USB cable to sync my Sequential synths with but I wanted to try a USB to 5 Pin cable and although the clock is being sent via USB from the DAW, the 5 pin MIDI in on the Sequential gear won't start at all. The sequencers don't activate, arpeggiators don't start. Nothing. What am I doing wrong? I've confirmed that the MIDI clock is being received via 5 pin din and I can see from the FORE cable that's lighting up information is being transmitted but it's just not being registered on the Tempest or Prophet.

Did you check that the "Midi Clock Cabel" Parameter in your globals is set to "Midi" instead of USB? I think it is named "Clock Port" on your P6. Just to check the obvious things first... but if your cable really works, this is the only thing I could think of.
Prophet Rev2, Novation Peak, Arturia DrumBrute Impact, Korg Kronos 2 88, Kurzweil PC 361, Yamaha S90ES

Re: Having difficulty with MIDI clock from DAW
« Reply #2 on: February 09, 2021, 04:11:12 PM »
I usually use a straight USB cable to sync my Sequential synths with but I wanted to try a USB to 5 Pin cable and although the clock is being sent via USB from the DAW, the 5 pin MIDI in on the Sequential gear won't start at all. The sequencers don't activate, arpeggiators don't start. Nothing. What am I doing wrong? I've confirmed that the MIDI clock is being received via 5 pin din and I can see from the FORE cable that's lighting up information is being transmitted but it's just not being registered on the Tempest or Prophet.

Did you check that the "Midi Clock Cabel" Parameter in your globals is set to "Midi" instead of USB? I think it is named "Clock Port" on your P6. Just to check the obvious things first... but if your cable really works, this is the only thing I could think of.

Yup I checked Clock Port in USB and in MIDI. No luck.

timboréale

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Re: Having difficulty with MIDI clock from DAW
« Reply #3 on: February 09, 2021, 06:13:39 PM »
I don't have a P6 but the Rev2 has a MIDI mode additional global parameter which ignores start/stop messages. You may want to make sure that one isn't selected in the P6, if there's an equivalent.
Rev2-16, Prophet 12 Keyboard, Nords, etc...

Re: Having difficulty with MIDI clock from DAW
« Reply #4 on: February 09, 2021, 06:31:08 PM »
I don't have a P6 but the Rev2 has a MIDI mode additional global parameter which ignores start/stop messages. You may want to make sure that one isn't selected in the P6, if there's an equivalent.

It's set so the sequencer should automatically start but it doesn't.

timboréale

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Re: Having difficulty with MIDI clock from DAW
« Reply #5 on: February 09, 2021, 06:41:59 PM »
And you've verified with a MIDI monitor that both the start message AND clock are being sent correctly? Plug the midi output back into your computer and monitor the input to be sure you see both the start and clock messages on that specific cable. Don't trust mere activity lights.
Rev2-16, Prophet 12 Keyboard, Nords, etc...

Re: Having difficulty with MIDI clock from DAW
« Reply #6 on: February 09, 2021, 06:48:10 PM »
And you've verified with a MIDI monitor that both the start message AND clock are being sent correctly? Plug the midi output back into your computer and monitor the input to be sure you see both the start and clock messages on that specific cable. Don't trust mere activity lights.

Yup I've selected "SEND MIDI CLOCK" "USE MIDI CLOCK START" in Studio One.

Like I said, it works perfectly with a regular USB cable but USB to 5 PIN DIN it doesn't for whatever reason.

timboréale

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Re: Having difficulty with MIDI clock from DAW
« Reply #7 on: February 09, 2021, 07:26:26 PM »
That doesn't mean your daw is sending it to the right interface or cable, or that your midi interface or router isn't filtering clock or start stop. Unless you stick a monitor on the physical end of the cable you plug into the synth and see the messages appearing you cannot rule that out - it's the most common issue short of plugging it in the wrong port!
Rev2-16, Prophet 12 Keyboard, Nords, etc...

Re: Having difficulty with MIDI clock from DAW
« Reply #8 on: February 09, 2021, 09:20:40 PM »
That doesn't mean your daw is sending it to the right interface or cable, or that your midi interface or router isn't filtering clock or start stop. Unless you stick a monitor on the physical end of the cable you plug into the synth and see the messages appearing you cannot rule that out - it's the most common issue short of plugging it in the wrong port!

How would I plug a monitor into a 5 Pin cable?

jok3r

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Re: Having difficulty with MIDI clock from DAW
« Reply #9 on: February 09, 2021, 10:44:13 PM »
That doesn't mean your daw is sending it to the right interface or cable, or that your midi interface or router isn't filtering clock or start stop. Unless you stick a monitor on the physical end of the cable you plug into the synth and see the messages appearing you cannot rule that out - it's the most common issue short of plugging it in the wrong port!

How would I plug a monitor into a 5 Pin cable?

Just like he said some posts above: put it back into an input on your PC and monitor the input with Midi OX or something.

Do you have another 5-Pin interface to double check? A lot of audio interfaces have classic Midi Ports, too.

Did you plug it in other synth? Do they recognize the clock signal?

Because your globals seem to be fine, I can't imagine that it has something to do with the synth. I would also guess it has something todo with the adapter cable...
Prophet Rev2, Novation Peak, Arturia DrumBrute Impact, Korg Kronos 2 88, Kurzweil PC 361, Yamaha S90ES

Re: Having difficulty with MIDI clock from DAW
« Reply #10 on: February 10, 2021, 06:02:41 AM »
That doesn't mean your daw is sending it to the right interface or cable, or that your midi interface or router isn't filtering clock or start stop. Unless you stick a monitor on the physical end of the cable you plug into the synth and see the messages appearing you cannot rule that out - it's the most common issue short of plugging it in the wrong port!

How would I plug a monitor into a 5 Pin cable?

Just like he said some posts above: put it back into an input on your PC and monitor the input with Midi OX or something.

Do you have another 5-Pin interface to double check? A lot of audio interfaces have classic Midi Ports, too.

Did you plug it in other synth? Do they recognize the clock signal?

Because your globals seem to be fine, I can't imagine that it has something to do with the synth. I would also guess it has something todo with the adapter cable...

This is what I'm using. It says it's being recognized with MIDI OX and things are working but none of the Sequential synths are recognizing it

https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B07SFCLNZ5/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o04_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

timboréale

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Re: Having difficulty with MIDI clock from DAW
« Reply #11 on: February 10, 2021, 06:29:44 AM »
There are several comments on that unit that suggest it doesn't work for some people. Perhaps yours is a dud. The method that I'm recommending is the only way to validate that MIDI information you think is being sent is actually being sent.

From what you've posted, I'm gathering that you do not have any other DIN MIDI interface at all, not on the back of a sound card, even?

My personal feeling is that the unit you have may be a dud - those are not particularly high quality items. I recommend using a known quality manufacturer - Roland's UM1X is a good unit, as are the various interfaces by iConnectivity and MOTU. Many audio interfaces (Focusrite, RME, MOTU, etc) have DIN MIDI either directly on the interface or on an included breakout cable as well. Any of these will work nicely for your needs, and you can plug a MIDI cable from output to input to loopback the data and monitor it on your computer, so you can validate the data stream as I have been suggesting.

With the cable you have purchased, this is not possible without an unusual adapter of some sort. In general, I recommend people avoid the type of adapter you've purchased for this among many other reasons, and go with a quality adapter that takes normal MIDI cables. You have some fine synths, don't cheap out on your interfaces. It's like putting used dishwater in the windshield fluid compartment of an Aston Martin and then blaming the wipers for not cleaning properly!  ;D
Rev2-16, Prophet 12 Keyboard, Nords, etc...

Re: Having difficulty with MIDI clock from DAW
« Reply #12 on: February 10, 2021, 07:34:06 AM »
There are several comments on that unit that suggest it doesn't work for some people. Perhaps yours is a dud. The method that I'm recommending is the only way to validate that MIDI information you think is being sent is actually being sent.

From what you've posted, I'm gathering that you do not have any other DIN MIDI interface at all, not on the back of a sound card, even?

My personal feeling is that the unit you have may be a dud - those are not particularly high quality items. I recommend using a known quality manufacturer - Roland's UM1X is a good unit, as are the various interfaces by iConnectivity and MOTU. Many audio interfaces (Focusrite, RME, MOTU, etc) have DIN MIDI either directly on the interface or on an included breakout cable as well. Any of these will work nicely for your needs, and you can plug a MIDI cable from output to input to loopback the data and monitor it on your computer, so you can validate the data stream as I have been suggesting.

With the cable you have purchased, this is not possible without an unusual adapter of some sort. In general, I recommend people avoid the type of adapter you've purchased for this among many other reasons, and go with a quality adapter that takes normal MIDI cables. You have some fine synths, don't cheap out on your interfaces. It's like putting used dishwater in the windshield fluid compartment of an Aston Martin and then blaming the wipers for not cleaning properly!  ;D

Thank you! :)

Any recommendations for specific MOTU devices? I'm actually making the switch to Digital Performer so that works well.

timboréale

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Re: Having difficulty with MIDI clock from DAW
« Reply #13 on: February 10, 2021, 07:51:48 AM »
I use RME gear but I've owned MOTU interfaces in the past and they're all solid, just choose what you want based on the feature set you need. Unless you'll be going DIN MIDI in a big way and need routing/filtering/etc (in which case I'd suggest the iConnectivity interfaces instead, for MIDI-specific concerns), if you only need one pair of I/O alongside a quality audio interface then take a close look at the Ultralite series - the AVB is a very flexible and expandable unit and makes a great starting point for a studio that might grow. They've all got one pair of DIN MIDI built in, no breakout or expander necessary. If you only want to add MIDI and are not concerned with the audio side of things, the microLite is a cheap and useful way to get simple, robust MIDI I/O to your computer. Their "Express" series add filtering and routing, but I haven't compared their offerings deeply to the iConnectivity stuff - the latter don't require custom drivers, though, so I tend to prefer them when you need to get more advanced.

Probably more information than you wanted, but hopefully it's helpful. Maybe some others here can chime in too, who use MOTU more than I do?
Rev2-16, Prophet 12 Keyboard, Nords, etc...

Re: Having difficulty with MIDI clock from DAW
« Reply #14 on: April 20, 2021, 06:46:39 PM »
Apparently this is actually something fairly common with the PX according to the PX Facebook group I admin. Could someone from Sequential comment please?