The New Sequential Prophet-5 and Prophet-10

[LoboLives]

The Prophet 10 feels like a missed opportunity to me. No one identifies the Prophet 10 with its single keyboard version. They wanted that dual manual version or at the very least a bi timbral version with poly sequencer. I appreciate Dave doing this but man....it was so close....even if it cost $10k I would put a pre order in for a synth like that so fast....

Well, Dave said on a synth chat video that there are two more products in the works excluding P5/10 modules and NOT a new Prophet-VS.

As for the single manual Prophet-10 from 1978, this couldn't really be done reliably then - and now it can. I think it's a great idea. I would choose that over a 5 if I had the money, which I don't. I'm gonna have to be contented with my P6, which I am but if cash came showering on me I would wait to see what Dave is bringing out next and then, depending on that, go for the present P10, unless he does another T8.

A T10 would be nice move for a bitimbral version with 76 keys poly aftertouch. That would be real competition for a certain 8000$ competitor. That's within reach really, just needs a few more knobs and a longer chassis.

I don’t see a monster VCO synth happening from Sequential again. In fact I don’t even see another Prophet happening.

[Sacred Synthesis]

I don’t see a monster VCO synth happening from Sequential again. In fact I don’t even see another Prophet happening.

Dave Smith is a prophet factory.  I expect to see at least several more prophets come from Sequential.

[LoboLives]

I don’t see a monster VCO synth happening from Sequential again. In fact I don’t even see another Prophet happening.

Dave Smith is a prophet factory.  I expect to see at least several more prophets come from Sequential.

A recent video interview he said he's sick of the name and so are most of the people at Sequential.

[Shaw]

I don’t see a monster VCO synth happening from Sequential again. In fact I don’t even see another Prophet happening.

Dave Smith is a prophet factory.  I expect to see at least several more prophets come from Sequential.

A recent video interview he said he's sick of the name and so are most of the people at Sequential.

What would he use next...  Messiah?  Visionist?  Palm-Reader?  The Snake Handler!?!? 


— I’m joking, of course.

[LPF83]

I don’t see a monster VCO synth happening from Sequential again. In fact I don’t even see another Prophet happening.

Dave Smith is a prophet factory.  I expect to see at least several more prophets come from Sequential.

A recent video interview he said he's sick of the name and so are most of the people at Sequential.

Although, he did also point out the reason it has been recycled so many times is that it is really hard to come up with decent product names that aren't already used.  If were Dave, I would just make sure that the name "Prophet" is used only for products that are truly aimed to capture the spirit of original instruments that are in the same vein.  For example, I think the use of Prophet '08, Prophet 6, Prophet Rev 2 are appropriate because they all have a certain "sounds like a Prophet" characteristic to them.  It was with Prophet 12, and Prophet X that I think things might have gone a little sideways, simply because of purely digital oscillators and each has a sound that (while good) differentiates itself greatly I think from the original Prophet.  Yes I know, there was the Prophet VS back in the day, but I think that was a candidate for a non-profit name as well.  At the same time, look how badly Roland has abused Juno/Jupiter names, and by that measure I don't think too much bad can be said about Dave's naming choices.

[LPF83]

All I can say is that Sequential smashed it out of the park with this one. I've owned at least one version or another of all of DSI-Sequential's instruments (aside from the Pro line), plus plenty of flagship synths/instruments from other brands. The P10 is by far my favorite instrument I've ever owned. When it was announced both the SSM and CEM filters would be featured, I thought it was a bit redundant considering how much people claim the REV 1/2 sound vastly superior, but I can happily say that the CEM is certainly different and will be used almost equally by me as it sounds phenomenal as well.

The only real negative which is purely subjective is that I don't like the action on FATAR keybeds on any of the keyboards I've owned, which range from the TP/40Wood to the TP/9 & 8.

Glad to see this kind of feedback... can you comment on what other synths you currently have (or recently had) that you're comparing it to?   I'm particularly interested in hearing from those who have (or had) a P6, because like a lot of P6 owners, I'm wondering how much overlap or difference there is between the two -- especially since I'm planning on getting a P10, but have no intention of selling my P6.

[PaulSchilling]

All I can say is that Sequential smashed it out of the park with this one. I've owned at least one version or another of all of DSI-Sequential's instruments (aside from the Pro line), plus plenty of flagship synths/instruments from other brands. The P10 is by far my favorite instrument I've ever owned. When it was announced both the SSM and CEM filters would be featured, I thought it was a bit redundant considering how much people claim the REV 1/2 sound vastly superior, but I can happily say that the CEM is certainly different and will be used almost equally by me as it sounds phenomenal as well.

The only real negative which is purely subjective is that I don't like the action on FATAR keybeds on any of the keyboards I've owned, which range from the TP/40Wood to the TP/9 & 8.

Glad to see this kind of feedback... can you comment on what other synths you currently have (or recently had) that you're comparing it to?   I'm particularly interested in hearing from those who have (or had) a P6, because like a lot of P6 owners, I'm wondering how much overlap or difference there is between the two -- especially since I'm planning on getting a P10, but have no intention of selling my P6.

I never had any issues with the feel of my P6's keybed but in comparison the new P5's keyboard feels better to me than the P6's. A bit less "clunky" for the lack of a better word. Smoother.

[A Thousand Eyes]

The only reason I sold my P6 is because I like to keep my setup minimal and had a hunch Sequential would do something special once the SSI2140 was in production. Kinda weird comparison, but the best way I can compare the two is by using an analogy ... The P6 is like some modern productions that are overly polished and overly round, whereas the P10 cuts out the unnecessary fat and nails the right EQ every time. I'd either have to add a little distortion, HPF, & perhaps sprinkle in some effect to get it in the ballpark of where I wanted with the P6 pre-EQ. Sometimes it would take all of the above, whereas the P10 doesn't need any of that and still gets the exact quality that my ears are personally attuned to.

P.S. I privately messaged you the laundry list.

[LPF83]

All I can say is that Sequential smashed it out of the park with this one. I've owned at least one version or another of all of DSI-Sequential's instruments (aside from the Pro line), plus plenty of flagship synths/instruments from other brands. The P10 is by far my favorite instrument I've ever owned. When it was announced both the SSM and CEM filters would be featured, I thought it was a bit redundant considering how much people claim the REV 1/2 sound vastly superior, but I can happily say that the CEM is certainly different and will be used almost equally by me as it sounds phenomenal as well.

The only real negative which is purely subjective is that I don't like the action on FATAR keybeds on any of the keyboards I've owned, which range from the TP/40Wood to the TP/9 & 8.

Glad to see this kind of feedback... can you comment on what other synths you currently have (or recently had) that you're comparing it to?   I'm particularly interested in hearing from those who have (or had) a P6, because like a lot of P6 owners, I'm wondering how much overlap or difference there is between the two -- especially since I'm planning on getting a P10, but have no intention of selling my P6.

I never had any issues with the feel of my P6's keybed but in comparison the new P5's keyboard feels better to me than the P6's. A bit less "clunky" for the lack of a better word. Smoother.

What are your initial thoughts about the overall sound of P5 vs the P6?   I know that most analog polys can (mostly) come very close to each other when recreating certain sounds -- but I always think that what a synth "does naturally" and "what it can potentially do" are two different things.  So I'm hoping to get some feedback on P5/10 vs P6, both in their natural habitats so to speak.  Raw tone comparisons without FX, filter differences, impact of the vintage knob / rev button, etc.

[LPF83]

The only reason I sold my P6 is because I like to keep my setup minimal and had a hunch Sequential would do something special once the SSI2140 was in production. Kinda weird comparison, but the best way I can compare the two is by using an analogy ... The P6 is like some modern productions that are overly polished and overly round, whereas the P10 cuts out the unnecessary fat and nails the right EQ every time. I'd either have to add a little distortion, HPF, & perhaps sprinkle in some effect to get it in the ballpark of where I wanted with the P6 pre-EQ. Sometimes it would take all of the above, whereas the P10 doesn't need any of that and still gets the exact quality that my ears are personally attuned to.

P.S. I privately messaged you the laundry list.

Interesting.  Would you attribute that to the effort required to make the P6 sound more vintage?  Or was it not really a matter of modern vs vintage preference?

[A Thousand Eyes]

Off the top of my head, I suppose I'd say the CEM3340 has a softer, i.e. more pleasing quality (to my ears at least) than the discrete VCOs on the P6, which are more brazen. Unlike the P6, there's a steep drop in the low-end once resonance is added. I know that the SSI2144 has the ability for low-end compensation for resonance, so if that's the case with the SSI2140, I'd make the suggestion of having that fully kick-in on the (modern) 4 setting of the vintage knob, which Dave described as altering more parameters than simply slop, as that would help cover more bases. There does seem to be slightly more low-end presence/lower frequency resonance as the vintage number goes in ascending order, but the max possible low-end compensation on the 4 would be welcome if that can be done.

[LoboLives]

I don’t see a monster VCO synth happening from Sequential again. In fact I don’t even see another Prophet happening.

Dave Smith is a prophet factory.  I expect to see at least several more prophets come from Sequential.

A recent video interview he said he's sick of the name and so are most of the people at Sequential.

Although, he did also point out the reason it has been recycled so many times is that it is really hard to come up with decent product names that aren't already used.  If were Dave, I would just make sure that the name "Prophet" is used only for products that are truly aimed to capture the spirit of original instruments that are in the same vein.  For example, I think the use of Prophet '08, Prophet 6, Prophet Rev 2 are appropriate because they all have a certain "sounds like a Prophet" characteristic to them.  It was with Prophet 12, and Prophet X that I think things might have gone a little sideways, simply because of purely digital oscillators and each has a sound that (while good) differentiates itself greatly I think from the original Prophet.  Yes I know, there was the Prophet VS back in the day, but I think that was a candidate for a non-profit name as well.  At the same time, look how badly Roland has abused Juno/Jupiter names, and by that measure I don't think too much bad can be said about Dave's naming choices.

Eh I dunno about that there’s been like 5 Prophets with digital oscillators at this point. Prophet 2000, Prophet 3000, Prophet VS, Prophet 12, Prophet X/XL. I think it’s gone passed the point of reserving the name for analog synths exclusively.

[LPF83]

I don’t see a monster VCO synth happening from Sequential again. In fact I don’t even see another Prophet happening.

Dave Smith is a prophet factory.  I expect to see at least several more prophets come from Sequential.

A recent video interview he said he's sick of the name and so are most of the people at Sequential.

Although, he did also point out the reason it has been recycled so many times is that it is really hard to come up with decent product names that aren't already used.  If were Dave, I would just make sure that the name "Prophet" is used only for products that are truly aimed to capture the spirit of original instruments that are in the same vein.  For example, I think the use of Prophet '08, Prophet 6, Prophet Rev 2 are appropriate because they all have a certain "sounds like a Prophet" characteristic to them.  It was with Prophet 12, and Prophet X that I think things might have gone a little sideways, simply because of purely digital oscillators and each has a sound that (while good) differentiates itself greatly I think from the original Prophet.  Yes I know, there was the Prophet VS back in the day, but I think that was a candidate for a non-profit name as well.  At the same time, look how badly Roland has abused Juno/Jupiter names, and by that measure I don't think too much bad can be said about Dave's naming choices.

Eh I dunno about that there’s been like 5 Prophets with digital oscillators at this point. Prophet 2000, Prophet 3000, Prophet VS, Prophet 12, Prophet X/XL. I think it’s gone passed the point of reserving the name for analog synths exclusively.

I guess we can just be grateful there isn't an "iProphet", some shitty phone app

(unless, that is, the iProphet turned out to really be an extra controller, that via bluetooth unlocked a bunch of LFOs / modulation possibilities that weren't available from the front panel of the P5/P10.... now THAT would be a helluva easter egg).

[LPF83]

Off the top of my head, I suppose I'd say the CEM3340 has a softer, i.e. more pleasing quality (to my ears at least) than the discrete VCOs on the P6, which are more brazen. Unlike the P6, there's a steep drop in the low-end once resonance is added. I know that the SSI2144 has the ability for low-end compensation for resonance, so if that's the case with the SSI2140, I'd make the suggestion of having that fully kick-in on the (modern) 4 setting of the vintage knob, which Dave described as altering more parameters than simply slop, as that would help cover more bases. There does seem to be slightly more low-end presence/lower frequency resonance as the vintage number goes in ascending order, but the max possible low-end compensation on the 4 would be welcome if that can be done.

All of this is good news to me so far, and in line with my plans.  I don't want to lose the punchiness of the bass or the pronounced leads that come out of the P6, but do want the softer/looser option, so hearing this, particularly the comments about the oscillators, reinforces my idea of keeping P6 while obtaining the new P (most likely a 10).

[LPF83]

Just saw this...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Shxj7VeKxLg

[LoboLives]

Just saw this...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Shxj7VeKxLg

Need to adjust some of the envelopes on the P6 to decrease the “click” of the snappy envelopes.

[LPF83]

Need to adjust some of the envelopes on the P6 to decrease the “click” of the snappy envelopes.

The similarities in sound in that particular video do still make me want to add a P5/10, but also make me want to hold off, really think through my existing setup, and decide if the new version of old is different enough from the P6 to be what I need in my next synth.

One one hand, yes, I already know it is, because I was already thinking of buying a second P6 (I like mine that much), while just having the 5 octave key bed, bigger knobs, etc. and the more vintage sound would be a huge plus.  Problem is, the next synth will occupy prime real estate on my 4 tier stand, so the choice must be made carefully.  I also have a 2 tier Ultimate and a 1 tier stand that aren't currently in use, but the 4 tier is where it all happens.

Some say the P6 and the OB-6 are too similar, but to me they are entirely different animals that complement each other, and the similarities are a plus (for speed of workflow).  My guess is that the same would be true by adding the P5/10 to my setup...  similar and different in the right amounts.  But I want to be certain, especially since the P5/10 will also probably result in some FX pedal purchases to do the things a P6 already does, over and above the four plus grand the synth itself costs.

[LoboLives]

Need to adjust some of the envelopes on the P6 to decrease the “click” of the snappy envelopes.

The similarities in sound in that particular video do still make me want to add a P5/10, but also make me want to hold off, really think through my existing setup, and decide if the new version of old is different enough from the P6 to be what I need in my next synth.

One one hand, yes, I already know it is, because I was already thinking of buying a second P6 (I like mine that much), while just having the 5 octave key bed, bigger knobs, etc. and the more vintage sound would be a huge plus.  Problem is, the next synth will occupy prime real estate on my 4 tier stand, so the choice must be made carefully.  I also have a 2 tier Ultimate and a 1 tier stand that aren't currently in use, but the 4 tier is where it all happens.

Some say the P6 and the OB-6 are too similar, but to me they are entirely different animals that complement each other, and the similarities are a plus (for speed of workflow).  My guess is that the same would be true by adding the P5/10 to my setup...  similar and different in the right amounts.  But I want to be certain, especially since the P5/10 will also probably result in some FX pedal purchases to do the things a P6 already does, over and above the four plus grand the synth itself costs.

You would require at least 3-4 effects pedals, an external sequencer and arpeggiator to accompany the P5 to get close to the features of the P6...but even the gentleman in the video said the P6 also has more range in terms of the values (Even plus negative parameters on envelopes and poly mod). I discussed the envelope settings in the comment section of the video and he admitted that the P6 has such a wide range to the parameters compared to the P5 that you really need to dial both of them differently to match the sound. It's still incredibly close though.

[LPF83]

Need to adjust some of the envelopes on the P6 to decrease the “click” of the snappy envelopes.

The similarities in sound in that particular video do still make me want to add a P5/10, but also make me want to hold off, really think through my existing setup, and decide if the new version of old is different enough from the P6 to be what I need in my next synth.

One one hand, yes, I already know it is, because I was already thinking of buying a second P6 (I like mine that much), while just having the 5 octave key bed, bigger knobs, etc. and the more vintage sound would be a huge plus.  Problem is, the next synth will occupy prime real estate on my 4 tier stand, so the choice must be made carefully.  I also have a 2 tier Ultimate and a 1 tier stand that aren't currently in use, but the 4 tier is where it all happens.

Some say the P6 and the OB-6 are too similar, but to me they are entirely different animals that complement each other, and the similarities are a plus (for speed of workflow).  My guess is that the same would be true by adding the P5/10 to my setup...  similar and different in the right amounts.  But I want to be certain, especially since the P5/10 will also probably result in some FX pedal purchases to do the things a P6 already does, over and above the four plus grand the synth itself costs.

You would require at least 3-4 effects pedals, an external sequencer and arpeggiator to accompany the P5 to get close to the features of the P6...but even the gentleman in the video said the P6 also has more range in terms of the values (Even plus negative parameters on envelopes and poly mod). I discussed the envelope settings in the comment section of the video and he admitted that the P6 has such a wide range to the parameters compared to the P5 that you really need to dial both of them differently to match the sound. It's still incredibly close though.

Although, in the comments he also expressed a slight preference for the P5, and mentioned on how the big knobs of the P5 really helped dial in that exact sound he was after.  This is something that actually matters a lot to me in terms of realtime playing/recording into the DAW.  I've never felt this was a shortcoming of the P6 or OB-6 for that matter, but large knobs do sound appealing.

Also, knowing me I would end up with pedals on the P5, but it's amazing what you can do with cheap or free plug-ins these days.  I mentioned Valhamma Supermassive (free) in another post, and already have Valhalla Vintage (also excellent and only $50)... these plug-ins are surprisingly competitive with my BigSky, so they're an option (and delay and chorus type pedals aren't all that expensive).

Then I come back to one fact -- like many, I've drooled over a vintage P5 for a long time, but was held back by concerns of needed repairs and reliability, worrying about whether a Rev 2 or 3 were better, the $7-8k pricetag, etc.  and then to all of a sudden to be able to buy a brand new one with Sequential warranty support at the prices they are asking, that has varying "vintagism" and switchable filters.... when I think about it from that standpoint, I'm like "what am I waiting for, just order it!"...

... then I remember I'm waiting for word on whether the P10 will be offering settable voice count or not..

[LoboLives]

Need to adjust some of the envelopes on the P6 to decrease the “click” of the snappy envelopes.

The similarities in sound in that particular video do still make me want to add a P5/10, but also make me want to hold off, really think through my existing setup, and decide if the new version of old is different enough from the P6 to be what I need in my next synth.

One one hand, yes, I already know it is, because I was already thinking of buying a second P6 (I like mine that much), while just having the 5 octave key bed, bigger knobs, etc. and the more vintage sound would be a huge plus.  Problem is, the next synth will occupy prime real estate on my 4 tier stand, so the choice must be made carefully.  I also have a 2 tier Ultimate and a 1 tier stand that aren't currently in use, but the 4 tier is where it all happens.

Some say the P6 and the OB-6 are too similar, but to me they are entirely different animals that complement each other, and the similarities are a plus (for speed of workflow).  My guess is that the same would be true by adding the P5/10 to my setup...  similar and different in the right amounts.  But I want to be certain, especially since the P5/10 will also probably result in some FX pedal purchases to do the things a P6 already does, over and above the four plus grand the synth itself costs.

You would require at least 3-4 effects pedals, an external sequencer and arpeggiator to accompany the P5 to get close to the features of the P6...but even the gentleman in the video said the P6 also has more range in terms of the values (Even plus negative parameters on envelopes and poly mod). I discussed the envelope settings in the comment section of the video and he admitted that the P6 has such a wide range to the parameters compared to the P5 that you really need to dial both of them differently to match the sound. It's still incredibly close though.

Although, in the comments he also expressed a slight preference for the P5, and mentioned on how the big knobs of the P5 really helped dial in that exact sound he was after.  This is something that actually matters a lot to me in terms of realtime playing/recording into the DAW.  I've never felt this was a shortcoming of the P6 or OB-6 for that matter, but large knobs do sound appealing.

Also, knowing me I would end up with pedals on the P5, but it's amazing what you can do with cheap or free plug-ins these days.  I mentioned Valhamma Supermassive (free) in another post, and already have Valhalla Vintage (also excellent and only $50)... these plug-ins are surprisingly competitive with my BigSky, so they're an option (and delay and chorus type pedals aren't all that expensive).

Then I come back to one fact -- like many, I've drooled over a vintage P5 for a long time, but was held back by concerns of needed repairs and reliability, worrying about whether a Rev 2 or 3 were better, the $7-8k pricetag, etc.  and then to all of a sudden to be able to buy a brand new one with Sequential warranty support at the prices they are asking, that has varying "vintagism" and switchable filters.... when I think about it from that standpoint, I'm like "what am I waiting for, just order it!"...

... then I remember I'm waiting for word on whether the P10 will be offering settable voice count or not..

While I absolutely support adjustable voice count I also think it might cannibalize the P5’s In regards to interest. The Moog One offered this option and almost no one bought an 8 voice version because of it.

From a business perspective Dave might just be like “if you want 5 voices, use a P5.”