The Official Sequential/DSI Forum

The New Sequential Prophet-5 and Prophet-10

Re: The New Sequential Prophet-5 and Prophet-10
« Reply #160 on: October 16, 2020, 10:48:51 AM »
"No one thought I was going to do it because I said I wasn't going to do it."

More of the same, please.   :)

"We're really excited about the next [instrument]...and we're deep into it...."

That's always good news.

https://youtu.be/bzysljTb8NQ?t=19145

Actually, he said yesterday that they are working on two new products. Wonder if it is P12 and Tempest ďsuccessorsĒ.

Great.  The more the merrier.
The Musical Synthesizer YouTube Channel:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UChLGwGiRVs7rlZXnOG9_mUw

The Musical Synthesizer Blog: https://themusicalsynthesizer.wordpress.co

ddp

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Re: The New Sequential Prophet-5 and Prophet-10
« Reply #161 on: October 16, 2020, 09:39:39 PM »
In that vein, this is a fun synth: https://polyend.com/medusa/
Buchla, Polyend, MicroFreak, Minimoog Model D, Subsequent, Moog One, Prophet X, Tempest, formerly Prophet 6 and Rev2.

Re: The New Sequential Prophet-5 and Prophet-10
« Reply #162 on: October 16, 2020, 10:02:29 PM »
About this new Prophet 5 REV4 from Sequential, I'll wait and try it for myself before I'll even consider getting it. Because, despite all of Dave's assurance, I'm not entirely convinced that this re-issue will be really up to the task of precisely matching it's ancestor soundwise. There have been attempts in the past to recapture the P5 glory with the P08, the Prophet 6, the Prophet REV2, without much success (being true to the original P5 I mean). Much like Moog Music tried and tried again to recapture the Minimoog D glory with the Moog Voyager, and a few other models until they finally realized that only a Minimoog D is worthy of that name, and they finally cloned it.
So far, the only company that is really successful at matching the sounds of the original machines they are cloning is...Behringer, and at a fraction of the price to boot! Why? Because they use the same schematics and same layouts as on the originals with cloned CEM3340 ICs from CoolAudio fab, not revised (read modified) re-issues like this OnChip Systems CEM3340 rev G.

So, we'll see, or rather hear, if this "modernized" Prophet 5 rev 4 can really shine as bright as its ancestor. I certainly hope so.
Minimoog D (vintage), OB6 (Desktop), Oberheim Matrix-6 (MIDI Controller), Prophet REV2-16, DeepMind 12, VC340

LPF83

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Re: The New Sequential Prophet-5 and Prophet-10
« Reply #163 on: October 17, 2020, 06:16:02 AM »
About this new Prophet 5 REV4 from Sequential, I'll wait and try it for myself before I'll even consider getting it. Because, despite all of Dave's assurance, I'm not entirely convinced that this re-issue will be really up to the task of precisely matching it's ancestor soundwise. There have been attempts in the past to recapture the P5 glory with the P08, the Prophet 6, the Prophet REV2, without much success (being true to the original P5 I mean). Much like Moog Music tried and tried again to recapture the Minimoog D glory with the Moog Voyager, and a few other models until they finally realized that only a Minimoog D is worthy of that name, and they finally cloned it.
So far, the only company that is really successful at matching the sounds of the original machines they are cloning is...Behringer, and at a fraction of the price to boot! Why? Because they use the same schematics and same layouts as on the originals with cloned CEM3340 ICs from CoolAudio fab, not revised (read modified) re-issues like this OnChip Systems CEM3340 rev G.

So, we'll see, or rather hear, if this "modernized" Prophet 5 rev 4 can really shine as bright as its ancestor. I certainly hope so.

I'm going to wait a while to purchase because I want to hear plenty of demos, I know Dave and crew have more backorders for the P5/P10 than they can handle at the moment, and I'm generally not in a rush... but my general thoughts on this are:

1.  All Sequential synths sound amazing
2.  Sequential is more qualified than any other company to do a proper re-issue
3.  All signs point to Dave taking the pedigree of the P5 to heart and making the new one the best it can be

... so I see nothing on the radar that would give me a pessimistic outlook on the P5 reissue.
Prophet 6, OB-6, Prophet 12m, Prophet Rev2-16, Korg Minilogue XDm, Roland SPD-30, Roland SPD-SX Special Edition, Roland KT-10, Maschine, Focusrite Scarlett 18i20 3rd Gen + Octopre, Strymon Pedals, Cubase Pro 10.5.

Re: The New Sequential Prophet-5 and Prophet-10
« Reply #164 on: October 17, 2020, 09:42:17 AM »
Shame that the 10 is not coming in a dual manual.  In terms of announcements,  this is HUGE!!!

I am certainly excited about the release of the Prophet 5 and Prophet 10 and will own one or the other soon enough.  As an owner of other Sequential synths and older Oberheim gear, however, wondering why Dual and Split modes (or similar) are never included.  My OB-8 and Xpander have those capabilities and they are over 30 years old.  The new Prophet 10 would check all my boxes if it had similar voice architecture to the original. 
Prophet 6, OB-6, OB-8, Xpander, Moog Sub37, Yamaha DXIIFD, Sequential Drumtraks, Yamaha RX-5, soon to be owner of a new Prophet 10.

Re: The New Sequential Prophet-5 and Prophet-10
« Reply #165 on: October 19, 2020, 10:11:09 AM »
Shame that the 10 is not coming in a dual manual.  In terms of announcements,  this is HUGE!!!

The new Prophet 10 would check all my boxes if it had similar voice architecture to the original.

Except it does. The original Prophet 10 wasnít bi timbral. They had to make it bi timbral with the dual manual keybed in order to help with overheating. Danny Zietlin who scored the 70s version of Invasion Of The Bodysnatchers used a single keyboard Prophet 10 alongside an orchestra. It was actually the first score to ever use a Prophet synth. He said his P10 would constantly go out of tune due to overheating and he could only use it a bit at a time to record.
Prophet 6, Prophet X, Tempest Drum Computer, ISLA S2400 Drum Sampler, Fender American Stratocaster, Roger Linn Adrenalinn iii, ASUS Zenbook Pro Computer, Soundcraft MTK 22 Mixer, Mark Of The Unicorn Digital Performer 10 Software.


Re: The New Sequential Prophet-5 and Prophet-10
« Reply #167 on: October 19, 2020, 10:12:21 PM »
I have yet to hear a convincing demo of the Prophet 5 REV4 that will demonstrate that it is as good sounding as the original one.

And these demos certainly don't help.
Minimoog D (vintage), OB6 (Desktop), Oberheim Matrix-6 (MIDI Controller), Prophet REV2-16, DeepMind 12, VC340

Re: The New Sequential Prophet-5 and Prophet-10
« Reply #168 on: October 20, 2020, 02:02:38 AM »
https://youtu.be/rVNGtj7tsN4

https://youtu.be/cJvF658lSOE

I can not say how unimportant it is for me if it sounds like the original or not. It just sounds really really good.
The second video is so great, really nice patches.


LPF83

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Re: The New Sequential Prophet-5 and Prophet-10
« Reply #169 on: October 20, 2020, 04:21:11 AM »
I have yet to hear a convincing demo of the Prophet 5 REV4 that will demonstrate that it is as good sounding as the original one.

And these demos certainly don't help.

Give it some time, I don't think anyone should expect to see lots of comparison videos this early in the product's lifecycle. 

It's unlikely we will see huge numbers of people who own a vintage P5 and are also first in line to order the new one, because for most people, owning either a vintage or a rev4 will be enough, and very few will own both.  Even among the small percentage of people who do want to own both, many of them are still waiting on their new unit at this point.  Dave's already said the demand was higher than expected and it's a backorder situation for many buyers.

Over time, we will see more cases such as someone borrowing a vintage P5 to make the comparison video, etc.
Prophet 6, OB-6, Prophet 12m, Prophet Rev2-16, Korg Minilogue XDm, Roland SPD-30, Roland SPD-SX Special Edition, Roland KT-10, Maschine, Focusrite Scarlett 18i20 3rd Gen + Octopre, Strymon Pedals, Cubase Pro 10.5.

Re: The New Sequential Prophet-5 and Prophet-10
« Reply #170 on: October 20, 2020, 05:01:53 AM »
Danny Zietlin who scored the 70s version of Invasion Of The Bodysnatchers used a single keyboard Prophet 10 alongside an orchestra. It was actually the first score to ever use a Prophet synth. He said his P10 would constantly go out of tune due to overheating and he could only use it a bit at a time to record.

Those Prophets had tendencies to die of spontaneous combustion?  ;D

Shaw

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Re: The New Sequential Prophet-5 and Prophet-10
« Reply #171 on: October 20, 2020, 10:44:30 AM »
My SW rep tells me I may get my P5 the second week of November....

"Classical musicians go to the conservatories, rockīn roll musicians go to the garages." --- Frank Zappa

Re: The New Sequential Prophet-5 and Prophet-10
« Reply #172 on: October 20, 2020, 10:58:23 AM »
My SW rep tells me I may get my P5 the second week of November....

Very nice!

Re: The New Sequential Prophet-5 and Prophet-10
« Reply #173 on: October 21, 2020, 04:21:16 AM »
As an ex Prophet 6 owner Iíd say this new P5 may well fix some of my gripes with the P6. First the 61 key keybed, probably my primary reason to sell the P6. Second the fact that the P6 does not produce a clean triangle wave. This was really frustrating because it meant that you had to use the filter to cutoff the erroneous harmonics. Meaning the filter couldnít be used to add the third oscillator in the classic organ patch etc. Third (and itís so long ago since I had my hands on a P5- 1982! So I canít remember if the P5 has this!) but the P6 canít be made to produce a deterministic DC LFO level, this is very frustrating for many live  modulation effects, where you want to add a static offset controlled in depth by mod wheel or AT etc.
So the P6 went.. but this new -old - P5 looks like it might address some of these issues.

Also Iím wondering if Dave has used the same modular internal structure for the P5 as DSI championed on the P6. Ie each voice was a module plugged into a back plane.
Big synth stuff: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCJkR38XLkFear5Sf9QypQvA
| Kurzweil Forte | Casio Privia PX 5s | Nord Electro 3 73 | Studiologic Sledge Black| Roland Juno Di | DSI Prophet 6 | Oberheim DPX 1 | EMU Esi 4000 | 2 x Yamaha Tx7 |

Re: The New Sequential Prophet-5 and Prophet-10
« Reply #174 on: October 21, 2020, 05:08:32 AM »
Also Iím wondering if Dave has used the same modular internal structure for the P5 as DSI championed on the P6. Ie each voice was a module plugged into a back plane.

This is how it's done in the Prophet-5/10 (the photo was posted in the French Audiofanzine forum and features the mainboard of a Prophet-10 with the extra 5 voices on top):

« Last Edit: October 21, 2020, 05:10:08 AM by Paul Dither »

Re: The New Sequential Prophet-5 and Prophet-10
« Reply #175 on: October 21, 2020, 06:26:51 PM »
I must admit while I absolutely love this....I am disappointed the P10 isnít bi timbral. I understand itís modelled after the single keyboard version and not the dual manual version but still. Thatís the one thing putting me off of the P10.

Also kind of shocked the lack of poly sequencer, lack of effects,...

Really considering dumping my P6 for a P5 but also looking at this from a practical point of view. Am I looking at this with nostalgia and aesthetic than something I can actually integrate into my setup? It requires some thought.

I'm not surprised by lack off effects, etc. It's a P5 or P10. A bit surprised by monononly output though but like the old one can be stereoised by external FX. If you dump the P6 for a P5, you may well miss the extra features, which I like.

As for the 10 voice, I would prefer 10 to 5. I find 5 not enough but six is enough andmakes the P6 kind of analogous to a 12 string guitar, 6 voices, 2 oscillator per voice.  OB6 too. I would love the 10 voice version because it was an aim in 1978 that didn't really come off. One voice per finger  unless you were Russ Conway. Having bitimbrality is a can of worms because then it becomes another Prophet T8.

I would think that the option to shut down 5 voices on the P10 would be nice so it plays like a P5, or to choose number of voices anywhere from 5 to 10, even better.

One other idea would be a 5 voice dual mode, with all 10 voices under 5 notes with the same patch, 4 oscillators per voice. That would not need storage of 2 patches  only one. That would be cool but less complex than bitimbrality.
Prophet-6 nut. Formerly, just a Prophet-5 nut.

Re: The New Sequential Prophet-5 and Prophet-10
« Reply #176 on: October 21, 2020, 06:53:05 PM »
The Prophet 10 feels like a missed opportunity to me. No one identifies the Prophet 10 with its single keyboard version. They wanted that dual manual version or at the very least a bi timbral version with poly sequencer. I appreciate Dave doing this but man....it was so close....even if it cost $10k I would put a pre order in for a synth like that so fast....

Well, Dave said on a synth chat video that there are two more products in the works excluding P5/10 modules and NOT a new Prophet-VS.

As for the single manual Prophet-10 from 1978, this couldn't really be done reliably then - and now it can. I think it's a great idea. I would choose that over a 5 if I had the money, which I don't. I'm gonna have to be contented with my P6, which I am but if cash came showering on me I would wait to see what Dave is bringing out next and then, depending on that, go for the present P10, unless he does another T8.

A T10 would be nice move for a bitimbral version with 76 keys poly aftertouch. That would be real competition for a certain 8000$ competitor. That's within reach really, just needs a few more knobs and a longer chassis.
Prophet-6 nut. Formerly, just a Prophet-5 nut.

Re: The New Sequential Prophet-5 and Prophet-10
« Reply #177 on: October 21, 2020, 07:03:26 PM »

"Really considering dumping my P6 for a P5 but also looking at this from a practical point of view. Am I looking at this with nostalgia and aesthetic than something I can actually integrate into my setup? It requires some thought."
 It's good to see from the manual that there are 7 velocity response curves and 8 aftertouch response curves, so that's more than my P6. It would be good if these curves were illustrated or published somewhere on the site.
Prophet-6 nut. Formerly, just a Prophet-5 nut.

Re: The New Sequential Prophet-5 and Prophet-10
« Reply #178 on: October 21, 2020, 10:10:53 PM »
Also Iím wondering if Dave has used the same modular internal structure for the P5 as DSI championed on the P6. Ie each voice was a module plugged into a back plane.

This is how it's done in the Prophet-5/10 (the photo was posted in the French Audiofanzine forum and features the mainboard of a Prophet-10 with the extra 5 voices on top):



I see a pattern here (Prophet REV2):
Minimoog D (vintage), OB6 (Desktop), Oberheim Matrix-6 (MIDI Controller), Prophet REV2-16, DeepMind 12, VC340

Re: The New Sequential Prophet-5 and Prophet-10
« Reply #179 on: October 22, 2020, 09:08:05 AM »
All I can say is that Sequential smashed it out of the park with this one. I've owned at least one version or another of all of DSI-Sequential's instruments (aside from the Pro line), plus plenty of flagship synths/instruments from other brands. The P10 is by far my favorite instrument I've ever owned. When it was announced both the SSM and CEM filters would be featured, I thought it was a bit redundant considering how much people claim the REV 1/2 sound vastly superior, but I can happily say that the CEM is certainly different and will be used almost equally by me as it sounds phenomenal as well.

The only real negative which is purely subjective is that I don't like the action on FATAR keybeds on any of the keyboards I've owned, which range from the TP/40Wood to the TP/9 & 8.