Prophet - 18

[ryankm]

Now I have been in the market for a new synth for awhile now as my Chroma Polaris is kind of thin and wanky.

Prophet - 6 is one of the most buitiful rich synths out there that money can buy, but it is limited.  I was excited when I saw Korg Prolouge 16, and Moog One, but both have cheezy digital sections that I don't want or need.

They need to combine 3 of these into one.  It would still be cheaper than a Moog One.  I miss the polyphony of the my old Super JX.  There are things you can do with 12+ notes rather than just six.  It is limiting.  What dose anyone have to say about this besides the Prophet 16 rev2?

[LoboLives]

As far as analog poly synths go, I'd rather them do the Prophet 20 with the option of a second manual keybed to be a successor to the Prophet 10.


Realistically though I think for the next Sequential poly synth, I'd rather see a VCO/Wavetable architecture which would be a successor to the Prophet 12/Poly Evolver. It's the one thing missing from Sequential's current catalog.

[Quatschmacher]

Now I have been in the market for a new synth for awhile now as my Chroma Polaris is kind of thin and wanky.

Prophet - 6 is one of the most buitiful rich synths out there that money can buy, but it is limited.  I was excited when I saw Korg Prolouge 16, and Moog One, but both have cheezy digital sections that I don't want or need.

They need to combine 3 of these into one.  It would still be cheaper than a Moog One.  I miss the polyphony of the my old Super JX.  There are things you can do with 12+ notes rather than just six.  It is limiting.  What dose anyone have to say about this besides the Prophet 16 rev2?

What “cheesy digital section” does the Moog One have? The Eventide effects? Prophet 6’s effects are digital too.

[ryankm]

[/quote]

What “cheesy digital section” does the Moog One have? The Eventide effects? Prophet 6’s effects are digital too.
[/quote]

Oh I did not know that.  I haven't looked at stats in about 4 years on any DSI synth.  I thought these were for purest.

You spend all that money and on something and all you have to do to get those same effects is run it through a computer and computers are easier to update.  You'd think they could come up with some stereo effects with circuitry and use the space on the knob panel to better use.  I looked through the manual and sent a message and I am unable to the resolution of the audio for these digital effects.  It is not just reverb.  That is important to me.  Hi res audio is hard to come by and now bluetooth 5.0 can stream lossless auidio.  I have to make my own and I don't want to spend thousands of dollars on something I don't need.  I've had digital effects before some are not bad, but they are supposed to be cheap.

[LPF83]

Now I have been in the market for a new synth for awhile now as my Chroma Polaris is kind of thin and wanky.

Prophet - 6 is one of the most buitiful rich synths out there that money can buy, but it is limited.  I was excited when I saw Korg Prolouge 16, and Moog One, but both have cheezy digital sections that I don't want or need.

They need to combine 3 of these into one.  It would still be cheaper than a Moog One.  I miss the polyphony of the my old Super JX.  There are things you can do with 12+ notes rather than just six.  It is limiting.  What dose anyone have to say about this besides the Prophet 16 rev2?

With Dave's existing VCO synths being around $500 per voice, I'm not sure a 16 voice VCO Prophet would really be cheaper than a Moog One.  I know you've already given the Rev2 consideration, but I feel this is Dave's answer to this dilemma. 

I guess my next thought depends on what kind of music you like to produce, but I enjoy rich vintage-sounding polysynths.  One of the keys to that vintage sound is that vintage synths were often limited to 6 voices or less, or 8 maximum.   Beyond that, typical chords can get crunched up and muddy due to too many voices available.  Hope I'm not offending any Moog One owners, but every video I've watched of it sounds bad to my ears.

But keep in mind you can always do a Prophet 6 keyboard + module, which gives 12 voices and keeps the price under $5k.  It also has the advantage of not having all the heat generated under one box, which in some climates goes a lot farther toward reliability and durability of the hardware than one might think.

I personally just pulled the trigger on a P6 to compliment my Rev2 and OB-6.  I was going to wait for the new synth announcement, but decided I'd rather not be an early adopter of a new product, as I prefer to buy things after a round or two of OS bug fixes and not deal with the risk of working bugs out of early manufacturing.

[Manbird]

I'd add that the Prophet 6's digital effects are quite lovely, and the Prologue's are gorgeous. Plus, the Prologue's User Osc section is a wonderful plus. I've only downloaded a few user oscs so far (I'm not a programmer and am not likely ever to make my own, but nice to have the option!), and have been very impressed. For as "analog(ue) purist" as I've wished to be, I'm quite delighted with all the digital bits lurking within my synths, turns out. 

[LPF83]

I'd add that the Prophet 6's digital effects are quite lovely, and the Prologue's are gorgeous. Plus, the Prologue's User Osc section is a wonderful plus. I've only downloaded a few user oscs so far (I'm not a programmer and am not likely ever to make my own, but nice to have the option!), and have been very impressed. For as "analog(ue) purist" as I've wished to be, I'm quite delighted with all the digital bits lurking within my synths, turns out.

I have a Minilogue XDm and while not 100% the FX are identical to the Prologue, I certainly regard them highly.  This little box plays a supplemental role in my setup, never a lead or primary pad, etc., but I will say I do find the third digital oscillator useful -- for example to add a tiny amount of bite or character to the existing VCOs without taking away from their analog nature.  The overall osc and filter is not in Sequential league, IMHO, so having this option on a synth from Dave combined with that overall Prophet sound would be amazing.

[Manbird]

I'd add that the Prophet 6's digital effects are quite lovely, and the Prologue's are gorgeous. Plus, the Prologue's User Osc section is a wonderful plus. I've only downloaded a few user oscs so far (I'm not a programmer and am not likely ever to make my own, but nice to have the option!), and have been very impressed. For as "analog(ue) purist" as I've wished to be, I'm quite delighted with all the digital bits lurking within my synths, turns out.

I have a Minilogue XDm and while not 100% the FX are identical to the Prologue, I certainly regard them highly.  This little box plays a supplemental role in my setup, never a lead or primary pad, etc., but I will say I do find the third digital oscillator useful -- for example to add a tiny amount of bite or character to the existing VCOs without taking away from their analog nature.  The overall osc and filter is not in Sequential league, IMHO, so having this option on a synth from Dave combined with that overall Prophet sound would be amazing.

It's the User Osc biz that's charmed me with the Prologue. I don't really use the digital osc much. Hammondeggsmusic makes the User Oscs I've so far loaded in. Wonderful stuff. And he makes a great BBD effect which turns his divide down osc into a righteous string machine. My gf has the OG Minilogue, and I dig it, but I don't know the XDm. I use the Prologue as often now as I use the Prophet 6. Different sounds/vibes, but very compatible. Two classics, I'd say.

[LPF83]

I'd add that the Prophet 6's digital effects are quite lovely, and the Prologue's are gorgeous. Plus, the Prologue's User Osc section is a wonderful plus. I've only downloaded a few user oscs so far (I'm not a programmer and am not likely ever to make my own, but nice to have the option!), and have been very impressed. For as "analog(ue) purist" as I've wished to be, I'm quite delighted with all the digital bits lurking within my synths, turns out.

I have a Minilogue XDm and while not 100% the FX are identical to the Prologue, I certainly regard them highly.  This little box plays a supplemental role in my setup, never a lead or primary pad, etc., but I will say I do find the third digital oscillator useful -- for example to add a tiny amount of bite or character to the existing VCOs without taking away from their analog nature.  The overall osc and filter is not in Sequential league, IMHO, so having this option on a synth from Dave combined with that overall Prophet sound would be amazing.

It's the User Osc biz that's charmed me with the Prologue. I don't really use the digital osc much. Hammondeggsmusic makes the User Oscs I've so far loaded in. Wonderful stuff. And he makes a great BBD effect which turns his divide down osc into a righteous string machine. My gf has the OG Minilogue, and I dig it, but I don't know the XDm. I use the Prologue as often now as I use the Prophet 6. Different sounds/vibes, but very compatible. Two classics, I'd say.

But you realize the user osc are digital, right?  Anything that's not OSC1 or OSC2 is digital.

Also, try the Pluck osc from Tim S., I use it all the time, well worth the $15 or so he asks for it.

[Manbird]

I'd add that the Prophet 6's digital effects are quite lovely, and the Prologue's are gorgeous. Plus, the Prologue's User Osc section is a wonderful plus. I've only downloaded a few user oscs so far (I'm not a programmer and am not likely ever to make my own, but nice to have the option!), and have been very impressed. For as "analog(ue) purist" as I've wished to be, I'm quite delighted with all the digital bits lurking within my synths, turns out.

I have a Minilogue XDm and while not 100% the FX are identical to the Prologue, I certainly regard them highly.  This little box plays a supplemental role in my setup, never a lead or primary pad, etc., but I will say I do find the third digital oscillator useful -- for example to add a tiny amount of bite or character to the existing VCOs without taking away from their analog nature.  The overall osc and filter is not in Sequential league, IMHO, so having this option on a synth from Dave combined with that overall Prophet sound would be amazing.

It's the User Osc biz that's charmed me with the Prologue. I don't really use the digital osc much. Hammondeggsmusic makes the User Oscs I've so far loaded in. Wonderful stuff. And he makes a great BBD effect which turns his divide down osc into a righteous string machine. My gf has the OG Minilogue, and I dig it, but I don't know the XDm. I use the Prologue as often now as I use the Prophet 6. Different sounds/vibes, but very compatible. Two classics, I'd say.

But you realize the user osc are digital, right?  Anything that's not OSC1 or OSC2 is digital.

Also, try the Pluck osc from Tim S., I use it all the time, well worth the $15 or so he asks for it.

Yes, the User Oscs are all digital. The original post mentioned the "cheezy digital sections," and my reply speaks to the idea that the digits doing their one/zero thing are quite sexy and incredibly usable.

Is Tim S the Hammondeggs fellow? I was a very slow starter with the user oscs, as my old laptop couldn't deal. I've upgraded and can download such now, but I've been pleased enough with the few user oscs I have that I've not been driven to seek more just yet.

[LPF83]

I'd add that the Prophet 6's digital effects are quite lovely, and the Prologue's are gorgeous. Plus, the Prologue's User Osc section is a wonderful plus. I've only downloaded a few user oscs so far (I'm not a programmer and am not likely ever to make my own, but nice to have the option!), and have been very impressed. For as "analog(ue) purist" as I've wished to be, I'm quite delighted with all the digital bits lurking within my synths, turns out.

I have a Minilogue XDm and while not 100% the FX are identical to the Prologue, I certainly regard them highly.  This little box plays a supplemental role in my setup, never a lead or primary pad, etc., but I will say I do find the third digital oscillator useful -- for example to add a tiny amount of bite or character to the existing VCOs without taking away from their analog nature.  The overall osc and filter is not in Sequential league, IMHO, so having this option on a synth from Dave combined with that overall Prophet sound would be amazing.

It's the User Osc biz that's charmed me with the Prologue. I don't really use the digital osc much. Hammondeggsmusic makes the User Oscs I've so far loaded in. Wonderful stuff. And he makes a great BBD effect which turns his divide down osc into a righteous string machine. My gf has the OG Minilogue, and I dig it, but I don't know the XDm. I use the Prologue as often now as I use the Prophet 6. Different sounds/vibes, but very compatible. Two classics, I'd say.

But you realize the user osc are digital, right?  Anything that's not OSC1 or OSC2 is digital.

Also, try the Pluck osc from Tim S., I use it all the time, well worth the $15 or so he asks for it.

Yes, the User Oscs are all digital. The original post mentioned the "cheezy digital sections," and my reply speaks to the idea that the digits doing their one/zero thing are quite sexy and incredibly usable.

Is Tim S the Hammondeggs fellow? I was a very slow starter with the user oscs, as my old laptop couldn't deal. I've upgraded and can download such now, but I've been pleased enough with the few user oscs I have that I've not been driven to seek more just yet.

Tim Shoebridge is another creator of 'Logue SDK customizations (different from Hammondeggs). Example here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iK1cYP6_054

[ryankm]

i have used digital effects, but in high resolution audio.  I use to record bass guitar through a bass amp via little built in webcam mic on my HP laptop and boost it in Audacity.  They had this fractional delay that sounded great too.  I still have those recordings and some of them are still my best.  It was able to record it at 32bit floating point 384khz resolution.

I use to have a Super JX and the added polyphony was great for synth Jazz Keys.  I want to do that again.  With the velocity sensitive where it will make the filter punchier if you hit it hard,  A quicker release, sustain and somewhat stringy synthy sound if you hold it, good basses, and exceptional ( sparkling) highs wwith a little vibrato on second DCO.  That one was great.  i could play that on any of my tracks.

I remember I could make it do like stardust shooting star kind of noises with a stereo tube amp I still have.  The 12 voice polyphony helped having each filter cascade down at 12 seperate points in time and different noted to create this shimmering cascade effect sound that was just beautiful.

Synth Jazz Keys!
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1F5KVeDvvYI0jSPMkC2nL9Aij2PULR0UV/view?usp=sharing

[LoboLives]

Now I have been in the market for a new synth for awhile now as my Chroma Polaris is kind of thin and wanky.

Prophet - 6 is one of the most buitiful rich synths out there that money can buy, but it is limited.  I was excited when I saw Korg Prolouge 16, and Moog One, but both have cheezy digital sections that I don't want or need.

They need to combine 3 of these into one.  It would still be cheaper than a Moog One.  I miss the polyphony of the my old Super JX.  There are things you can do with 12+ notes rather than just six.  It is limiting.  What dose anyone have to say about this besides the Prophet 16 rev2?

With Dave's existing VCO synths being around $500 per voice, I'm not sure a 16 voice VCO Prophet would really be cheaper than a Moog One.  I know you've already given the Rev2 consideration, but I feel this is Dave's answer to this dilemma. 

I guess my next thought depends on what kind of music you like to produce, but I enjoy rich vintage-sounding polysynths.  One of the keys to that vintage sound is that vintage synths were often limited to 6 voices or less, or 8 maximum.   Beyond that, typical chords can get crunched up and muddy due to too many voices available.  Hope I'm not offending any Moog One owners, but every video I've watched of it sounds bad to my ears.

But keep in mind you can always do a Prophet 6 keyboard + module, which gives 12 voices and keeps the price under $5k.  It also has the advantage of not having all the heat generated under one box, which in some climates goes a lot farther toward reliability and durability of the hardware than one might think.

I personally just pulled the trigger on a P6 to compliment my Rev2 and OB-6.  I was going to wait for the new synth announcement, but decided I'd rather not be an early adopter of a new product, as I prefer to buy things after a round or two of OS bug fixes and not deal with the risk of working bugs out of early manufacturing.

Agree 100% on the "too many voices" aspect. I find it's quite difficult to get it to sit properly in a mix, especially if you have multiple synths running at once.

[LPF83]

Agree 100% on the "too many voices" aspect. I find it's quite difficult to get it to sit properly in a mix, especially if you have multiple synths running at once.

This is one reason I decided not to get a second OB-6, as much as I love my keyboard.  It is good for having that one killer sound, bass or lead or just something unworldly that only that lovely Oberheim filter can do.  But the same warmth and thickness that sometimes makes me glad it only has 6 voices.  I think 12 or 16 voices, all with the natural "slop" that VCOs tend to have, can be hard to make work with complex chords with long releases.  This I think is why the slightly more precise sound of DCOs is better for applications needing higher polyphony.

[Sacred Synthesis]

I think 12 or 16 voices, all with the natural "slop" that VCOs tend to have, can be hard to make work with complex chords with long releases.  This I think is why the slightly more precise sound of DCOs is better for applications needing higher polyphony.

Good point.  The DCO seems to be a happy compromise between thickness and thinness of tone for excessively  polyphonic music. 

[ryankm]

I think 12 or 16 voices, all with the natural "slop" that VCOs tend to have, can be hard to make work with complex chords with long releases.  This I think is why the slightly more precise sound of DCOs is better for applications needing higher polyphony.

Good point.  The DCO seems to be a happy compromise between thickness and thinness of tone for excessively  polyphonic music.

You can tune VCO's pretty sharply too.    All i have is a Chroma Polaris and that is known for being thin, but sounds pretty rich when compared with 95% of what is out there.  I'm having difficulties with it right now though so...

How would y'all compare the DSI v. Roland DCO's in terms of bass?  Can the DSI DCO /VCF's punch through a mix the way Roland can?

[LPF83]

You can tune VCO's pretty sharply too.    All i have is a Chroma Polaris and that is known for being thin, but sounds pretty rich when compared with 95% of what is out there.  I'm having difficulties with it right now though so...

How would y'all compare the DSI v. Roland DCO's in terms of bass?  Can the DSI DCO /VCF's punch through a mix the way Roland can?

I don't have any Roland synths currently but owned a Juno 106 back in the day which had GREAT bass from DCOs.   In some ways the Rev2 feels like two Junos that can be stacked or split.  You can certainly get a great bass out of the DCOs of the Rev2.   There is something to my ear about that low-end warmth that comes so easily out of the OB-6 and Prophet 6 though.   I only got my Prophet 6 today and I'm still going through the presets.  Before I unboxed it, I thought the OB-6 had the most inspiring bass I've heard, but now I think the P6 might actually have it beat.

Just remember with the Rev2 you have so many modulation options available that just carving a bass sound out of the init patch on one layer is not going to showcase what it can do.  I haven't even tried to see how fat of a bass I can make out of the two layers with some modulation tricks.  Maybe after I'm past the honeymoon phase with the P6.

Does Roland currently make a DCO synth?  I always thought the JD-XA was VCO, but admit to not keeping up with their product line.

[LoboLives]

You can tune VCO's pretty sharply too.    All i have is a Chroma Polaris and that is known for being thin, but sounds pretty rich when compared with 95% of what is out there.  I'm having difficulties with it right now though so...

How would y'all compare the DSI v. Roland DCO's in terms of bass?  Can the DSI DCO /VCF's punch through a mix the way Roland can?

I don't have any Roland synths currently but owned a Juno 106 back in the day which had GREAT bass from DCOs.   In some ways the Rev2 feels like two Junos that can be stacked or split.  You can certainly get a great bass out of the DCOs of the Rev2.   There is something to my ear about that low-end warmth that comes so easily out of the OB-6 and Prophet 6 though.   I only got my Prophet 6 today and I'm still going through the presets.  Before I unboxed it, I thought the OB-6 had the most inspiring bass I've heard, but now I think the P6 might actually have it beat.

Just remember with the Rev2 you have so many modulation options available that just carving a bass sound out of the init patch on one layer is not going to showcase what it can do.  I haven't even tried to see how fat of a bass I can make out of the two layers with some modulation tricks.  Maybe after I'm past the honeymoon phase with the P6.

Does Roland currently make a DCO synth?  I always thought the JD-XA was VCO, but admit to not keeping up with their product line.

Almost positive the JDXa has DCOs

[ryankm]

You can tune VCO's pretty sharply too.    All i have is a Chroma Polaris and that is known for being thin, but sounds pretty rich when compared with 95% of what is out there.  I'm having difficulties with it right now though so...

How would y'all compare the DSI v. Roland DCO's in terms of bass?  Can the DSI DCO /VCF's punch through a mix the way Roland can?

I don't have any Roland synths currently but owned a Juno 106 back in the day which had GREAT bass from DCOs.   In some ways the Rev2 feels like two Junos that can be stacked or split.  You can certainly get a great bass out of the DCOs of the Rev2.   There is something to my ear about that low-end warmth that comes so easily out of the OB-6 and Prophet 6 though.   I only got my Prophet 6 today and I'm still going through the presets.  Before I unboxed it, I thought the OB-6 had the most inspiring bass I've heard, but now I think the P6 might actually have it beat.

Just remember with the Rev2 you have so many modulation options available that just carving a bass sound out of the init patch on one layer is not going to showcase what it can do.  I haven't even tried to see how fat of a bass I can make out of the two layers with some modulation tricks.  Maybe after I'm past the honeymoon phase with the P6.

Does Roland currently make a DCO synth?  I always thought the JD-XA was VCO, but admit to not keeping up with their product line.

No they don't.  I had a Juno 106 and a Super JX and both were great.  I got the Super JX, which is an amazing synth; for only 300 dollars.  I got the PG 800 and had a great time with it.  It had stereo outputs and 12 voices.  I was always splitting the keyboard to do a analog bass wuith left hand and chorusing stereo string saw pad with my right.  Unfortunatly I did to much aderal installing Vecoven Mod in and slopped solder and crossed some wires and couldn't ever get the thing to power on again and the Juno I sold.

I think the JDXA is on of those hybrid synths with 100% digital oscillator section.

From memory of having DCO Roland synths...  They are silky smooth warm precise instruments.  And that digital precision on the oscillators can make them do some pretty crazy stuff.  VCO's just sound better in my opinion.  Warmer deeper bases.  Brighter sounding.  Like pure electricity.

[LPF83]

You can tune VCO's pretty sharply too.    All i have is a Chroma Polaris and that is known for being thin, but sounds pretty rich when compared with 95% of what is out there.  I'm having difficulties with it right now though so...

How would y'all compare the DSI v. Roland DCO's in terms of bass?  Can the DSI DCO /VCF's punch through a mix the way Roland can?

I don't have any Roland synths currently but owned a Juno 106 back in the day which had GREAT bass from DCOs.   In some ways the Rev2 feels like two Junos that can be stacked or split.  You can certainly get a great bass out of the DCOs of the Rev2.   There is something to my ear about that low-end warmth that comes so easily out of the OB-6 and Prophet 6 though.   I only got my Prophet 6 today and I'm still going through the presets.  Before I unboxed it, I thought the OB-6 had the most inspiring bass I've heard, but now I think the P6 might actually have it beat.

Just remember with the Rev2 you have so many modulation options available that just carving a bass sound out of the init patch on one layer is not going to showcase what it can do.  I haven't even tried to see how fat of a bass I can make out of the two layers with some modulation tricks.  Maybe after I'm past the honeymoon phase with the P6.

Does Roland currently make a DCO synth?  I always thought the JD-XA was VCO, but admit to not keeping up with their product line.

Almost positive the JDXa has DCOs

I believe you're right about that after doing a bit of reading.  The price point (for only 4 DCO voices, even with the additional digital voices) is a bit inappropriate  IMHO, and I guess that's what had me fooled.