Responsiveness of Pro-2 Knobs

[binman_uk]

All,

I've just raised a support call with DSI because the jumpy encoders on the synth are driving me mental at times (and a couple of others I've spoken to in the DSI Pro-2 group on Facebook). I sent the following:

I can move the knobs quite a bit without the sound being affected in any way whatsoever - they're just not as responsive as I would expect.

As an example, let's say I start with an init patch and create a new sound.
Knobs are set to Absolute in the globals but the other options don't affect the issue in any way.
I'm sequencing the synth via external midi on a loop.
Cutoff is 26.
I can move the cutoff knob a mm or two before it actually affects the sound.
As soon as I move it more than that, it does affect the sound but the cutoff value has jumped to 32 by that point.
This make delicate tweaking of sounds whilst recording quite difficult.

Was just curious if anyone else experiences the same issue?

Cheers

[BobTheDog]

The only time my knobs jump is if I have a midi loop going on, can you check that?

Also if you use the stepped encoders above the screen does it do it?

[binman_uk]

The only time my knobs jump is if I have a midi loop going on, can you check that?

Also if you use the stepped encoders above the screen does it do it?

No there's definitely no midi loop. I tested and it does the same with the internal sequencer and even when I play the keyboard with no incoming midi.
The stepped encoders work fine, which would be fine as a workaround for me but it's impossible to change both the filter cutoff and decay at the same time if I use those (for example).

Was making a track before and the cutoff and env knobs were jumping by up to 6 increments. There's a mm or so of wiggle room before the synth actually realises that I'm turning one of the knobs.

[BobTheDog]

I would get in contact with DSI support to ask them, I can adjust the knobs on mine with increments of 1.

Is it all your knobs or just a few?

[binman_uk]

I would get in contact with DSI support to ask them, I can adjust the knobs on mine with increments of 1.

Is it all your knobs or just a few?just

I haven't gone round testing all of them but it's a fair few of them to be honest. This is why I was thinking it's a software issue. Turning them should just scroll smoothly through the values but they just don't do that.  Recorded a video:

https://youtu.be/-4WAZO7R_aE

[BobTheDog]

I watched the video.

I just tested mine and there is a initial jump when you start moving the knob, on mine this is usually 2, sometimes 3. Once the knob is moving then it increments by 1. If I then wait and use the same knob again it increments by 1. If I use another knob and then return to the original knob I get the jump of 2 again.

I never noticed this before. It looks like there is some code there that is damping the knobs to stop jitter when the P2 thinks that a human might not be turning it, I guess to stop values oscillating between two adjacent values when the knob is in the middle of those values.

Yours is definitely acting differently to mine though, what version of the OS have you got installed.

[binman_uk]

I'm on 1.1.15 at the moment but was going to try 1.2.0.2 later to see if it makes any difference.

I'm not 100% sure but it seems worse if I use a knob that uses a different parameter page and then try to move the original knob again. Had it jumping up to six increments in the past.

Thanks for looking at this so quickly though Bob.

[binman_uk]

Update: i changed to OS to 1.2.0.2 and it's still the same.

[BobTheDog]

Hi,

I just checked to see if changing params on different pages had an effect here, doing this I also get the jump of 5 like you do.

So params on the same page I get 2, params on different pages I get 5.

Once the knobs are moving though I get no jumps, they are smooth.

Maybe someone from DSI can shed some light on this, I will contact them...

Edit:: Reading the thread again I see you have contacted DSI, did you hear anything?

Edit 2: I tried to PM Carson who is the support guy at DSI but it says that I am blocked from sending PMs to him. So I guess the best bet is to wait for your support request to be answered.

[binman_uk]

No reply from support as of yet.

It's definitely a big issue for me. If I wanted to tweak the decay and cutoff at the same time throughout a track for example, it's just a nightmare to try and do it seamlessly. I'm sure there are reasons why it's doing from a coding perspective that may have made sense when they were doing it, such as preventing constant updating of the display when nothing is being touched, but I think they went a bit overboard with it .

It seems like something that could be easily fixable though.. hopefully they recognise it as a fault.

[BobTheDog]

It does seem a bit wonky to me.

I'm not sure how I never noticed it before, I wonder if it was introduced with one of the updates.

Also I had the P12 module first so I tend to use the encoders around the screen quite a bit on the P2 as well. Or maybe thats why I use the encoders and I just can't remember. Always possible!

[goodweather]

Hi, I have also not seen this before.
About the same behaviour as BobTheDog.
Filter 1 Cutoff: 0 to 2, not possible to get a 1...
Filter 2 Cutoff: very difficult to get numbers between 160 and 164...
So there is most probably some responsiveness issue with the knobs.

Did you get a reply from DSI support?
Otherwise I look in Tech support site and post also something.

I also tested with the editor I'm busy to build and there it is OK. I have full precision when moving the mouse and the synth follows exactly the value.

[binman_uk]

Did you get a reply from DSI support?
Otherwise I look in Tech support site and post also something.

Not yet, I'll report back when I hear anything. Thanks for testing.. it's good to at least know I'm not alone with this issue and it probably affects everyone.

[sofine]

Filter 1 Cutoff: 0 to 2, not possible to get a 1...
Filter 2 Cutoff: very difficult to get numbers between 160 and 164...
So there is most probably some responsiveness issue with the knobs.

Same issue here for me

[binman_uk]

Do you all get the even bigger jumps when you, for example...

Set the cutoff to 50
Wiggle a knob that uses a different parameter page so the screen changes
Turn the cutoff again

Mine jumps to 54-56 or so (or 44-46 if you turn it the other way)

Cheers.

[goodweather]

Do you all get the even bigger jumps when you, for example...

Set the cutoff to 50
Wiggle a knob that uses a different parameter page so the screen changes
Turn the cutoff again

Mine jumps to 54-56 or so (or 44-46 if you turn it the other way)

Cheers.

Just did the test and I confirm it is also like that on my Pro2
Filter1 cutoff on 50
Modify Filter2 Resonance
Slightly move Filter1 Cutoff and first figure shown is 45

So... Something for DSI to check.

I must also mention that indeed the upper knobs allows moving figures 1 by 1.
So using the main knobs for fast movements but then use the top ones for more precise ones.
This is probably the intended way of working...

[binman_uk]

I must also mention that indeed the upper knobs allows moving figures 1 by 1.
So using the main knobs for fast movements but then use the top ones for more precise ones.
This is probably the intended way of working...

Thanks for checking. I can't imagine that is the intent to be honest though... you can't use the parameter page encoders if you need to tweak filter 1 and 2 simultaneously (for example). You're stuck using the jumpy pots

[sofine]

Do you all get the even bigger jumps when you, for example...

Set the cutoff to 50
Wiggle a knob that uses a different parameter page so the screen changes
Turn the cutoff again

Mine jumps to 54-56 or so (or 44-46 if you turn it the other way)

Cheers.

Yep, same here again!

I haven't found it to be a huge issue tbh, but it's a little annoying. Also, the refresh rate of the screen is not smooth at all - whereas I read that it was in a previous OS. Maybe the current OS workload is too much for the CPU

[binman_uk]

Is anyone still on the very first OS and could test it as well?

I'd be interested to know if this happens with the original firmware or if it's a bug introduced at a later date.

[goodweather]

I have 1.1.0