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"Realms of Fantasy" Soundbank for the Prophet REV2 has been released!

Razmo

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And please! ... if any of you who bought the bank has any kind of constructive critique, feel free to write it in here! ... I want to hear this, so I can think about if there is something I may do better next time :)

Personally, I want to change how the controllers are used, and that's because I've experienced, that some controllers (like my newly aquired V-Synth GT) has a spring-loaded Modwheel... many of the presets I did was with the Mod Wheel meant as a constant value... a set and forget control... but with a spring-loaded modwheel, this completely destroys the intention.

Thus I'm going to see pitchwheel, modwheel, velocity and aftertouch as performance controls instead... the foot pedal will still be used since most controller keyboards has a jack for this, but that's as far as I will go... this means that some presets will have the assignments changed a bit.
« Last Edit: May 15, 2019, 01:50:01 PM by Razmo »
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Razmo

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As I've started making the rev1.1 of the bank, I can tell a little about what I'll do to the sounds in the bank:

1. I'll eliminate all usage of Aftertouch. The reason is, that I really do not find Aftertouch all that important. In most cases, and on many controller keyboards, Aftertouch requires considerable force to initiate, making it very stressing for the fingers, and at the same time, the physical sensitivity control of aftertouch is not really good in my opinion... I've only found it suitable for one thing ever, and that's vibrato... but with the considerable amount of stress you have to put on your fingers, it's not really worth it... another reason is that I now have the module version of REV2, and even though my V-Synth GT sports an Aftertouch sensitive keybed, not everyone may have a controller keybed with aftertouch if they use the REV2 module. I want as many users to be able to use my sounds as intended.

2. I'll eliminate the usage of the Foot Pedal... as above, not everyone have a Foot Pedal, and that's the sole reason for removing this control. The Foot Pedal was good for changing the sound live while playing with both hands, but if you want to use both hands, and still control the modulation with your foot, there are options out there to let you route a Foot Pedal to the Mod Wheel to achieve the same functionality... for most presets though, what was modulated by the Foot Pedal will in bank 1.1 be controlled either by the Mod Wheel, or Velocity... I found that making velocity control the same actually gave many sounds a much more complex modulated sound, and that is because Velocity is per voice, where the Foot Pedal is always a global control modulation.

3. I'll take out some of the presets, and create some new ones. This is some of the "SYN:" presets, some of the "SEQ:" presets (no one want to use predefined sequences anyway) will be changed into playable instruments instead. A few of the Bell sounds may get a heavy makeover since some of them utilize the FX engine which makes them sound strange when played polyphonically. They will probably be made monophonic instead to overcome this. And lastly, I'll thin out in some of the VOC presets, as too many are very close to each other in sound.

4. Many sounds did not have velocity sensitivity, so I will introduce this on those sounds that do not have this. It allows for more expressive playing...

In fact, one of the things that got less attention when I released the bank is exactly how the physical controls work, so this is probably the main goal for version 1.1

That's about it... I'll write in this thread when the revised bank is finished.

Some of you may wonder why I am simply not creating the same modulation as the ModWheel on both Foot Pedal and Aftertouch... that would also be a good thing to do, if it was not for two things: 1. The modulations would add up, meaning that if you moved both ModWHeel, Aftertouch and FootPedal, you'd end up with tripple the amount of modulation as intended... and 2. There simply are not enough modulation slots for this on many of the presets, as it would require a lot of extra modulation slots to be available for this, and having this on some presets, and not others defy my autistic symmetry feelings  ;D

« Last Edit: May 16, 2019, 03:03:12 AM by Razmo »
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jok3r

Some of you may wonder why I am simply not creating the same modulation as the ModWheel on both Foot Pedal and Aftertouch... that would also be a good thing to do, if it was not for two things: 1. The modulations would add up, meaning that if you moved both ModWHeel, Aftertouch and FootPedal, you'd end up with tripple the amount of modulation as intended... and 2. There simply are not enough modulation slots for this on many of the presets, as it would require a lot of extra modulation slots to be available for this, and having this on some presets, and not others defy my autistic symmetry feelings  ;D

Wouldn't it be good, if Modwheel amount was a mod destination? I guess one could achieve that with some dirty midi hacks... but with a destination for that it would work out of the box.
Prophet Rev2, Novation Peak, Korg Kronos 2 88, Kurzweil PC 361, Yamaha S90ES,  Akai MPK 261

Razmo

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Some of you may wonder why I am simply not creating the same modulation as the ModWheel on both Foot Pedal and Aftertouch... that would also be a good thing to do, if it was not for two things: 1. The modulations would add up, meaning that if you moved both ModWHeel, Aftertouch and FootPedal, you'd end up with tripple the amount of modulation as intended... and 2. There simply are not enough modulation slots for this on many of the presets, as it would require a lot of extra modulation slots to be available for this, and having this on some presets, and not others defy my autistic symmetry feelings  ;D

Wouldn't it be good, if Modwheel amount was a mod destination? I guess one could achieve that with some dirty midi hacks... but with a destination for that it would work out of the box.

I'm not sure if that would do the trick... but some simple additions to the Global menu, where you could decide where to route the physical controllers would be nice... this way you could say that the Foot Pedal input should be seen as another physical controller, say; the ModWheel... then both ModWheel and FootPedal would go to the same mod matrix source... an additional parameter to decide if the physical control should either ADD the value to the mod matrix source, or use an ABSOLUTE method (latest moved control decides the value)... but I doubt this will be implemented... nothing seems to get feature updates in here anymore, only the last synth released seems to get a feature update here and there...

To be honest... if anyone would rather want to move the control to something else, then I may create different banks tailored each to a certain controller... so that one bank has it on ModWheel, another on FootPedal etc... then the user could decide for themselves which they prefer... but it's actually pretty quick to do this yourself... just enter the modmatrix and change anything that say "ModWheel" in the source to "FootPedal" instead.

Personally I'm lucky... My V-Synth GT allow me to choose what CC# any physical control send out via MIDI, so I can simply change the Pedal to also send CC01 for the ModWheel... I could even use a knob, a D-Beam or the XY-Pad on the GT for this...
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Razmo

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Re: "Realms of Fantasy" Soundbank for the Prophet REV2 has been released!
« Reply #44 on: July 09, 2019, 01:43:54 PM »
Thought I'd better say, that I am still working on the revised bank... not done yet... hollidays and stuff came in the way, but it's still being worked on right now.

Until further notice, here is a short demo of one of the new sounds in the bank called "Oxygenetics":

http://razmo.ziphoid.com/Oxygenetics.mp3

This is clearly an attempt at creating the swirling phaser motion of Jean Michel Jarre's Oxygene pad that was originally created using the Eminent 310 unique organ, and aan Electro Harmonix Smallstone phaser... Getting "that phaser sound" is impossible unless you use the real thing... I've not even heard another analog phaser being able to do this kind of phasing, unless it's a clone... so do't expect the real deal here... it's as close as I can get using ONLY the REV2. It's a 16 voice preset btw. using the build in phaser carefully.
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Re: "Realms of Fantasy" Soundbank for the Prophet REV2 has been released!
« Reply #45 on: July 24, 2019, 03:55:06 AM »
  Can't wait.  I use the first 16 sounds more than any other presets on this instrument.  Fantastic job on those.
Looking forward to the update.
Prophet Rev2, SonicCore Xite-1,CP300,CS5,SK20

Razmo

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Re: "Realms of Fantasy" Soundbank for the Prophet REV2 has been released!
« Reply #46 on: July 24, 2019, 04:02:54 AM »
  Can't wait.  I use the first 16 sounds more than any other presets on this instrument.  Fantastic job on those.
Looking forward to the update.

I'm close to finishing the bank... just want to make sure it's as perfect as i can get it... I'll guess it's ready in the beginning of August (I'm going on holliday for the next 4 days right now, so cannot touch my REV2 in that period) :)

The first 16 presets are the ambient ones if I recall right... yeah... probably way too few of these in this "mixed bag bank" ... but I'll change that when I start on the next bank which will focus more on Drones and Ambient moving textures.

I have removed some of the presets from the original bank that I found too mediocre, and I'll make sure that some of them will be replaced with new Ambient presets... it seems that these are what most users like the most.
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maxter

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Re: "Realms of Fantasy" Soundbank for the Prophet REV2 has been released!
« Reply #47 on: July 24, 2019, 06:25:57 AM »
+1 here. Really like those ambient patches, a few of the others were cool too but not something that I'll potentially be using. Kudos to Razmo for going back to polish the bank!

Re: "Realms of Fantasy" Soundbank for the Prophet REV2 has been released!
« Reply #48 on: July 27, 2019, 05:21:45 PM »
really well done clean patches! i just got a rev 2 and im having problems building clean sounding patches so here is proof that this is possible :-) im listening to realms of fantasy and if that is just the output of the rev 2 it can all be done.

have you ever thought about patches that are connected to certain tunings? for ambient music i think the power of the rev 2 lies in the tuning possibilites, complex harmonics, frequency stacking etc.
« Last Edit: July 27, 2019, 05:24:30 PM by lilakmonoke »

Razmo

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Re: "Realms of Fantasy" Soundbank for the Prophet REV2 has been released!
« Reply #49 on: July 29, 2019, 12:47:41 AM »
really well done clean patches! i just got a rev 2 and im having problems building clean sounding patches so here is proof that this is possible :-) im listening to realms of fantasy and if that is just the output of the rev 2 it can all be done.

have you ever thought about patches that are connected to certain tunings? for ambient music i think the power of the rev 2 lies in the tuning possibilites, complex harmonics, frequency stacking etc.

It's the REV2 100% yes... no external FX involved, that was one of my goals when I made the bank; to use it for ambient right out of the box... but with that said, if you switch off the internal reverb (or not) and throw the programs thru a high quality external reverb, it certainly sounds even better.

Regarding tunings... no, I've actually never messed around with those... never really found a use for it much, but maybe it can be used for something unique when it comes to Ambient styles, I do not know... Problem with the tuning though is that users would have to upload these separately from the programs, and as I cannot save the tuning used with the preset (as far as I know, I may be wrong), then it would become a bit problematic. How would you know what tuning scale to use for which program?
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Razmo

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Re: "Realms of Fantasy" Soundbank for the Prophet REV2 has been released!
« Reply #50 on: July 30, 2019, 12:48:45 PM »
Just a Pad sound I'm working on for the revised bank (100% REV2):

http://razmo.ziphoid.com/GlitterBox.mp3

For this one I used a bit of an unusual trick... I actually used the glide mode polyphonically, even if it normaly sound really bad (notes gliding about in all different directions)... I did not use it the standard way (for pitch), but rather I switched glide on for oscillator 1, which is synced to oscillator 2... in that way I use glide to create weird and pseudo random sync sweeps... with a Pad sound like this, where the attack phases of the filter and amp are a bit long, the effect is subtle, but it gives some nice random'ish movement to the sound as you switch chords as you play... I think that sync with glide may be useable for many other interesting tricks... just to let you know, in case anyone wants to mess around with this. An alternative would be to also use it for FM on the filter and then Oscillator Mix set all the way up (to only hear oscillator 2)... you'd have to use the tuneable filter for this of course.

For polyphonic glides, direct pitch control is not of much use, but in this case this abnormal way of glide can actually be put to some good use :)
« Last Edit: July 30, 2019, 12:50:39 PM by Razmo »
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Re: "Realms of Fantasy" Soundbank for the Prophet REV2 has been released!
« Reply #51 on: July 30, 2019, 01:33:23 PM »
Nice sounding patch!, and good idea to use glide with sync osc... I'm gonna play around with that. 

Polyphonic glide can definitely be hard to get predictable/good results... One trick that I've played around with Poly Glide is to copy layer A to layer B, then set the keyboard in SPLIT mode and set glide only on the second layer...  so you have exact same timbre on both, but using split to limit the "glide keys" to only the upper register... this halves the voices using glide, and reduces the randomness of having sudden large swings from bass notes to upper registers.   It allows you to really push the glide times up to higher amounts.  I bet this approach would work really well with sync idea. 

Voice Component Modeling (VCM) Soundset - 128 Patches for the Prophet Rev2 - NOW AVAILABLE on Sellfy: https://sellfy.com/p/figZ/

Razmo

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Re: "Realms of Fantasy" Soundbank for the Prophet REV2 has been released!
« Reply #52 on: August 06, 2019, 11:10:47 PM »
http://razmo.ziphoid.com/AvianForest.mp3

The above is a small demo of one of the presets in the bank (Avian Forest), that has been tweaked. I'm putting up this example because it shows pretty well what the major upgrade in the modulation control is with practically all the presets.

As I wrote earlier, I decided to drop the use of the Pedal as a controller, and simply stick to Velocity, Pitch Wheel and Mod Wheel. The reason is that you will not need to buy a pedal to use the presets, but also because many physical controls are monophonic, including the pedal. This means that what ever these controls are set to, they will effect the voices the same, and at the same time... I switched the pedal to Velocity instead, since velocity is actually a polyphonic physical control, and it allows for much more varied modulation of the sounds (just listen to the example above... the low keys are played soft, the higher ones at varying velocity)... it gives so much more when playing the presets performance wise, and you do not have to think about moving one of your hands to a mod wheel... I feel it makes the sounds feel much more alive and like you're actually playing an instrument. Also, the movement in the sounds sound much more modulated since each voice is modulating in different ways, especially the Ambient presets.

The pitch and mod wheels are mainly used for pitch bend and vibrato on all the presets, in one way or another, as this is basically what they serve best... Aftertouch is not used at all, except for a single preset that highly benefit from it... This basically standardize these monophonic controls in their use, which makes it easier to remember what they actually do.

The example above is 100% REV2 by the way...
« Last Edit: August 06, 2019, 11:16:42 PM by Razmo »
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Re: "Realms of Fantasy" Soundbank for the Prophet REV2 has been released!
« Reply #53 on: August 07, 2019, 05:05:10 AM »
Just as a counterpoint I appreciated that your initial bank had foot pedal assignments and would recommend keeping them as it adds a fair amount of enjoyment to playing with some of your sounds.

Razmo

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Re: "Realms of Fantasy" Soundbank for the Prophet REV2 has been released!
« Reply #54 on: August 07, 2019, 05:57:29 AM »
Just as a counterpoint I appreciated that your initial bank had foot pedal assignments and would recommend keeping them as it adds a fair amount of enjoyment to playing with some of your sounds.

Don't worry, that was the plan to keep both the old and new bank... Both banks will be in the archive, so you can chose whatever version you like, or both ;)
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