Prophet X Speculation

Sacred Synthesis

Re: Prophet X
« Reply #60 on: May 01, 2018, 01:00:11 PM »
What does it sound like?

Re: Prophet X
« Reply #61 on: May 01, 2018, 01:15:01 PM »
What does it sound like?

Well, I posted some demos over in the Prophet X forum. First of all, the filters are entirely different. The stereo mode further alters the articulation of timbres. And the whole sample content naturally gives it a massively different flavor, as you have hundreds of sounds that never ever came out of a DSI synth before.

Re: Prophet X
« Reply #62 on: May 01, 2018, 02:12:38 PM »
User samples i the future... where did i hear that before :D ...

Well there are two options: either buy now or wait until the user sample feature works.

I am absolutely thrilled at the news - but given the cost, I'll def be in the "wait and see" camp. For the price I would have hoped for at least 4-part multitimbral and split/layers. Still, the more laptops this thing keeps off stages, the better!  :D

Re: Prophet X
« Reply #63 on: May 01, 2018, 02:22:18 PM »
User samples i the future... where did i hear that before :D ...

Well there are two options: either buy now or wait until the user sample feature works.

I am absolutely thrilled at the news - but given the cost, I'll def be in the "wait and see" camp. For the price I would have hoped for at least 4-part multitimbral and split/layers. Still, the more laptops this thing keeps off stages, the better!  :D

There are splits and layers.

Re: Prophet X
« Reply #64 on: May 01, 2018, 02:27:38 PM »
User samples i the future... where did i hear that before :D ...

Well there are two options: either buy now or wait until the user sample feature works.

I am absolutely thrilled at the news - but given the cost, I'll def be in the "wait and see" camp. For the price I would have hoped for at least 4-part multitimbral and split/layers. Still, the more laptops this thing keeps off stages, the better!  :D

There are splits and layers.

Yes - but just one split point or a layer, right? Much like the other duotimbral DSI boards?

Re: Prophet X
« Reply #65 on: May 01, 2018, 02:28:55 PM »
Yes - but just one split point or a layer, right? Much like the other duotimbral DSI boards?

The Prophet X is bitimbral, yes.

Re: Prophet X Speculation
« Reply #66 on: May 01, 2018, 02:57:36 PM »
The filter sounds just like my Prophet '08. Samples sound beautiful. Curse you Dave Smith! How am I going to get the money?!

LoboLives

Re: Prophet X
« Reply #67 on: May 01, 2018, 04:07:11 PM »
User samples i the future... where did i hear that before :D ...

Well there are two options: either buy now or wait until the user sample feature works.

I am absolutely thrilled at the news - but given the cost, I'll def be in the "wait and see" camp. For the price I would have hoped for at least 4-part multitimbral and split/layers. Still, the more laptops this thing keeps off stages, the better!  :D

I would have like to somehow have had the ability to sequence each of the oscillators individuals but meh it’s nit picking. I’m sold at this point.

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Re: Prophet X
« Reply #68 on: May 01, 2018, 07:28:29 PM »
Strange that user import of samples is not till the end of the year, I guess it is to give space to 8Dio to sell some ridiculously priced instrument packs.

I suspect it's because the system is beyond "take a bunch of linear PCM samples and switch them by key and velocity," and probably way beyond editing this stuff within the keyboard. They probably developed a low-level system to process the packs, but it's not friendly enough for commercial users yet. I release a lot of features this way at work, where Support needs to set them up by hand in the database while my team makes a nice interface for it. That way, users have access to features sooner.
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Re: Prophet X Speculation
« Reply #69 on: May 01, 2018, 11:22:14 PM »
UK prices round about £3,300 approximately. I'd definitely have to sell my Moog Sub37 to fund this !
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Re: Prophet X
« Reply #70 on: May 02, 2018, 12:40:36 AM »
Strange that user import of samples is not till the end of the year, I guess it is to give space to 8Dio to sell some ridiculously priced instrument packs.

I suspect it's because the system is beyond "take a bunch of linear PCM samples and switch them by key and velocity," and probably way beyond editing this stuff within the keyboard. They probably developed a low-level system to process the packs, but it's not friendly enough for commercial users yet. I release a lot of features this way at work, where Support needs to set them up by hand in the database while my team makes a nice interface for it. That way, users have access to features sooner.

I must admit I thought it would be just a simple key/velocity mapped system, I'm definitely interested to see if it isn't!

Re: Prophet X Speculation
« Reply #71 on: May 02, 2018, 12:41:45 AM »
Anyone heard if it might support MPE?

Razmo

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Re: Prophet X
« Reply #72 on: May 02, 2018, 01:44:06 AM »
User samples i the future... where did i hear that before :D ...

Listened to the demos... sounds very P12'ish with the synth sounds... The price though... I'm not sure... yet...

It doesn't sound like the P12 at all I have to say.

Well... I do not agree on that one... I'm talking about the synth oscillators, not the sampling ones :) it's hard to describe, but the many demos on Soundcloud that seemed to not focus on the sampling engine sounded P12'ish to me... besides, the interface with the OLED display is exactly the same as on the P12, and we've seen DSI reuse their code on more than one instrument, so it would be the easiest way to just take two P12 voices and throw them in with some bells and whistles like Dave always do... The filters are different yes, but I do not hear anything characterful in any of the demo's on Soundcloud that impress me I'm afraid--- this could be due to the programing of course, and many of them just sound like ROMpler samples with the characeristic speedup and down when playing different keys, which I find funny since the featurelist say it can do time stretching (I now wonder if the time stretching is an off-line processing of samples, or actual realtime timestretching... i certainly hope the later)... actually I found many of those demos harsh soundingly digital... the same way that the digital Girth/Air etc. part of the P12 impart on the sound of it's digital oscillators. an unmistakingly harsh digital grungyness...

I thought hard about if I was to say it... but I just have not heard something yet that makes me go "wow!" ... it sounds to me like a sample player playing through analog Curtis filters even if it's not... not that this is bad, I'm still considering this instrument since I don't mind the Curtis sound, especially on a synth that I would be doing PAD sounds and ambient stuff with... i do not need booming MOOG filters or the like... If it's done right, I'll consider it... but I'd like to see the full spec list (user manual) before taking a decision... also, if I am to get such complicated a synth I'd want a WORKING and FULL FEATURED editor to come with it... we're living in the 21st century, and I have no intention of working this thing from those small screens when programming sounds, so I hope that DSI will at some point start taking editors more serious.

A full fledged editor, with the added ability of editing the sample setup as well would be a minimum requirement... especially at this pricepoint.

Please don't see this as a bashing... it's not... this is a really cool and deep synth with a lot of potential (as far as I know the specs until now)... I'm just not the person who fall into instant hyping just because a well reknowned synth guru push out a new synth... I listen, i read and then I judge on that without thinking about who made it. I like the ideer of this synth, actually I've been begging for this synth from DSI in the past, and they heard the call (thanks for that DSI!)... I think the only thing I do not like is the pricepoint :D ... I hope this thing will get a module as well because that will be my aim... otherwise I would have to get rid of my KB37 and get a modular case instead for my Eurorack stuff, and use the X as masterkeyboard... tempting because of the 5oct keybed, but time will tell.... I do need ONE polysynth, and I could easily see the X as that... so no bashing from me... just honesty about what i hear. :)
« Last Edit: May 02, 2018, 02:07:09 AM by Razmo »
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AlanC

Re: Prophet X Speculation
« Reply #73 on: May 02, 2018, 03:30:41 AM »
It seems the filters are the new Sound Semiconductor SSI2144:

https://www.kraftmusic.com/sequential-prophet-x

To my ears, at least, the X seems to have a character that's rather different to any previous DSI synth, and I'm guessing those filters are the reason.



Razmo

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Re: Prophet X Speculation
« Reply #74 on: May 02, 2018, 03:38:33 AM »
It seems the filters are the new Sound Semiconductor SSI2144:

https://www.kraftmusic.com/sequential-prophet-x

To my ears, at least, the X seems to have a character that's rather different to any previous DSI synth, and I'm guessing those filters are the reason.

Link does not work :)
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AlanC

Re: Prophet X Speculation
« Reply #75 on: May 02, 2018, 04:04:54 AM »
Link does not work :)

Looks like the whole of kraftmusic.com is down at the moment.

Edit: It's working now.
« Last Edit: May 02, 2018, 04:07:02 AM by AlanC »

Razmo

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Re: Prophet X Speculation
« Reply #76 on: May 02, 2018, 04:46:20 AM »
"It's worth pointing out, too, that while 'samples through analog filters' seems to have been the primary design consideration the story certainly doesn't end there, with two digital oscillators per voice seemingly derived from those in Prophet 12 that offer a variety of waveshapes as well as waveshape modulation."

from the artikle at Kraftmusic... so it is a new SSM revision filter chip... but notice that also Kraftmusic is talking about the digital oscillators being from the P12, excactly as I thought because of the way they sounded to me in the demos ;)

But the new SSM2044 like chip is certainly interresting, even though I do not feel I've heard them "in action" yet to be able to hear the character of them... I still feel the sound of the X sounds more like Curtis filters than SSM filters... but as I said; it's probably because of the programming... don't know... I may also be tricked into hearing curtis timbres simply because the digital oscillators has that typical P12 Dave Smith like timbre on top of the filters... fact is I can definitely hear a "Dave Smith Character" in those demos... I've had so many DSI synths by now I'd claim to know the character ;)

Still an interresting machine though... I read that it has the supersaw waveform... that indicates some of the PRO2's waveshape features has been ported to the X... and the PRO2 was derived from the P12 oscillators... so I'm pretty certain by now, that it's just new soup, cooked on old bones when it comes to the digital oscillators.

If I'd have the abillity to make ONE change to what I know of this synth by now, it would have been the abillity to CHOOSE either sample or synth engine on the four oscillators for more flexibillity... would have been nice to be able to decide to utilize 4 synth oscillators or 4 sample oscillators in a patch... but that would probably be too much of a contender to their P12 ;)
« Last Edit: May 02, 2018, 04:55:22 AM by Razmo »
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LoboLives

Re: Prophet X Speculation
« Reply #77 on: May 02, 2018, 06:48:01 AM »
Personally I would have totally skipped on the Oscillators all together and had two more spots for instruments. I don't see myself ever using them at all. I already have analog gear with sawtooth, triangle, square waves etc oscillators I don't need a virtual analog oscillator to accompany them.

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Re: Prophet X Speculation
« Reply #78 on: May 02, 2018, 08:29:39 AM »
Personally I would have totally skipped on the Oscillators all together and had two more spots for instruments. I don't see myself ever using them at all. I already have analog gear with sawtooth, triangle, square waves etc oscillators I don't need a virtual analog oscillator to accompany them.

Samples are a whole lot less tweakable in realtime than synth oscillators, so if the aim was to make this synth catch a lot of sonic territory, then those oscillators is crucial... but I can see the need for four instruments too... that's why i wrote that it would have been nice to select the type of oscillator for each of the four "oscillators"... because i can certainly see a lot of potential for the mix as it is now too... the synth also appeal to more people this way.
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LoboLives

Re: Prophet X Speculation
« Reply #79 on: May 02, 2018, 08:57:29 AM »
Personally I would have totally skipped on the Oscillators all together and had two more spots for instruments. I don't see myself ever using them at all. I already have analog gear with sawtooth, triangle, square waves etc oscillators I don't need a virtual analog oscillator to accompany them.

Samples are a whole lot less tweakable in realtime than synth oscillators, so if the aim was to make this synth catch a lot of sonic territory, then those oscillators is crucial... but I can see the need for four instruments too... that's why i wrote that it would have been nice to select the type of oscillator for each of the four "oscillators"... because i can certainly see a lot of potential for the mix as it is now too... the synth also appeal to more people this way.

That's true, I wish the VS waves were in the oscillator section instead of the sample section but apparently you can manipulate them and use them as oscillators (I guess similar to the Tempest engine) and with the two touch strips on the side, maybe a bit of simulated vector manipulation?

That being said though Raz, maybe samples are actually a lot more tweakable in realtime with this engine. It's still too early to tell but with a more in depth walk through maybe it holds a lot of surprises.

I see a lot of people complaining about the price...but I do wonder perhaps sampling really is an expensive endeavor? A lot of people don't realize that Fairlights were $25,000 and Synclaviers were $100,000. I don't think Dave or Waldorf deliberately set out to make $4k synths but at the end of the day they ended up costing what they did. There must be a reason for it, maybe the processing power or storage of the samples, I don't know. As far as alternatives...well no other synth company now is doing lower priced Emulators or Ensoniq type synths...hell almost no one is doing samplers at all! So until Behringer wants to make an Ensoniq Mirage clone or Emulator clone for $1000...this is it.