Pro 2 occasional dead notes in paraphonic mode

[msflsim]

Hey guys, have you ever noticed when playing the Pro 2 in paraphonic mode that some voices would be 'lost'? This happens on the init patch but turning the para mode on. Its mostly noticeable when I play single note lines. Im on fw 1.3

[Paul Dither]

That's because on the init patch only the volume of oscillator 1 is turned up. If you turn up the volume of oscillators 2-4, you'll hear all voices in paraphonic mode.

[msflsim]

Hi Paul, thanks.

All the osc's are turned up and i can hear 4 notes if playing a chord. This is more like a glitch where everything would play ok and then sometimes a note will not sound when i press the key.

That's because on the init patch only the volume of oscillator 1 is turned up. If you turn up the volume of oscillators 2-4, you'll hear all voices in paraphonic mode.

[Paul Dither]

Depending on how the envelopes are set up in your case, it could also be related to the fact that as long as you keep on holding a note in paraphonic mode, the envelopes won't be retriggered with each additional keystroke.

[msflsim]

I am in para mode, playing a legato line without holding any of the notes and one of the voices plays a dead note sometimes

[Paul Dither]

Legato style playing can be one reason for not retriggering the envelopes. Ultimately, it depends on what the envelopes control. If an envelope controls the oscillators' levels and is set to a percussive response, you can end up with the impression that one oscillator doesn't make a sound. That's just one possible case, though. If it doesn't happen with all sounds, you'd have to reverse-engineer what causes this behaviour in paraphonic mode. Remember that paraphonic mode still means monophonic behavior of the envelopes. No matter how many notes you press in paraphonic mode, the envelopes will still behave in a monophonic manner according to the retrigger option you've selected (on or off).

[msflsim]

Thanks for the suggestions. I do understand that the oscillators are all sharing one envelope.

Would you be able to test this on your Pro 2 and reply back perhaps? Init sound, para on, all osc's on, play single notes and see if any voices drop out.

Legato style playing can be one reason for not retriggering the envelopes. Ultimately, it depends on what the envelopes control. If an envelope controls the oscillators' levels and is set to a percussive response, you can end up with the impression that one oscillator doesn't make a sound. That's just one possible case, though. If it doesn't happen with all sounds, you'd have to reverse-engineer what causes this behaviour in paraphonic mode. Remember that paraphonic mode still means monophonic behavior of the envelopes. No matter how many notes you press in paraphonic mode, the envelopes will still behave in a monophonic manner according to the retrigger option you've selected (on or off).

[Soundquest]

msflsim,

What Paul is describing is pretty pronounced and will cause what you described.  Seems you are saying that this happens even if played slow, single notes lifting you fingers completely off keys from an initial patch (no other mod) and with even distributed frequency.   That might be a reason to contact support.

PS> I had a bad cable cause me issues that I thought were instrument related.  It really fooled me for a while as there seemed to be a even pattern of occurrence on higher notes.  I don't know why that would be, unless output signal was slightly different at different notes.  New cord fixed everything.  But for the heck of it, just make sure you try direct headphones too to eliminate down the path variables.

[Paul Dither]

Would you be able to test this on your Pro 2 and reply back perhaps? Init sound, para on, all osc's on, play single notes and see if any voices drop out.

I just tried this out myself. I initiated the basic program, turned the volume up for all oscillators, and made sure that a waveform for all oscillators is selected. I couldn't detect any dropouts in this case. I played legato and with sustained/held notes.

[Peter K.]

I have noticed this as well.  Maybe it's a technique thing on my part causing the envelope to choke, because it only happens on faster phrases.  I will keep this page open and experiment to see if it's a technique thing or a technical thing.  Maybe it can be prevented with slightly different envelope settings. 

[msflsim]

Glad to hear I am not the only one! I often use the paraphonic mode but play single notes and it happens often enough to be noticeable. I haven't managed to accurately reproduce it.

I have noticed this as well.  Maybe it's a technique thing on my part causing the envelope to choke, because it only happens on faster phrases.  I will keep this page open and experiment to see if it's a technique thing or a technical thing.  Maybe it can be prevented with slightly different envelope settings.

[ttc]

Just want to add that I have also experienced this.

At times, it has been obvious issues a la envelope, different oscillator levels etc, but it also happens inexplicably sometimes. The potential issue seemed resolved yesterday when I disconnected from USB, like maybe some midi info was getting to the synth that was causing the oddities. Hard to say for sure, but I feel pretty well versed on this synth now and have not been able to nail this issue down.

[Peter K.]

I have been experimenting with envelope release times - usually making them shorter - and this seems to have solved the issue.  I'm not just talking about the VCA Env, but the filters too.  Seems like the problem is solved. 

[prscully20]

Just want to add that I have also experienced this.

At times, it has been obvious issues a la envelope, different oscillator levels etc, but it also happens inexplicably sometimes. The potential issue seemed resolved yesterday when I disconnected from USB, like maybe some midi info was getting to the synth that was causing the oddities. Hard to say for sure, but I feel pretty well versed on this synth now and have not been able to nail this issue down.

I’m glad I stumbled on this thread - I always assumed the paraphonic mode was a bit quirky with dropped notes etc. but turns out I was having the same problem when connecting via USB(in Logic). When I disable MIDI control in global the paraphonic mode works as intended. Does anybody know of what could be causing the issue with USB and the paraphonic mode?

[nedped]

Somewhat related to this discussion, I understand that all 4 oscillators have to be on to play a 4-note chord (or to avoid dead notes when playing lines), but I'm mystified as to why chord inversions occur with every strike of the keys. Happens on Pro 2 and Matrixbrute, so I assume its just a characteristic of paraphonic structure. Would make a cool effect but its an unwanted default. 

[Quatschmacher]

I had an intermittent problem like this with my former Pro 2. It was really random but I did manage to document it happening and sent a video to support. They couldn’t work out what the problem was. It usually stopped if I power cycled the synth.