Decided I might go for the ARP over the Two Voice Pro

[LoboLives]

After much consideration I've decided I may go for the ARP over the Two Voice Pro. At least for the time being. A few reasons for this.

1.) Price. The Two Voice Pro is incredibly expensive (about $5000 for me) and I contemplated it for a long time. It's essentially a really good sequencer with two great synth modules and a nice keyboard all in a single unit...however...in terms of capabilities would an Engine Sequencer and two ARP Odyssey Modules suffice? All I'd be using this for is for sequencing while my Prophet does the leads/pads. So would $5000 be worth the investment for a musical element that could be had for a lot less? The TVS Pro ticks all the boxes but at what cost?

2.) Reliability. I went down to Long And McQuade in Toronto here and inquired if they would be able to deal with Oberheim directly...they told me flat out "No." and explained to me that about a year or so ago they tried to order a bunch of product from Tom and it was still unaccounted for. They were sympathetic that it's a small operation by an elderly man but they had tons of orders that never got filled and decided to cancel everything. This brings up a very good point, Tom IS a small operation and I've read that a lot of Two Voices arrived in with some non working elements. From the bend box not working, to one SEM's midi channel malfunctioning...but I'm not sure how reliable the warranty would be for such a small operation or what a turnaround time would be....and for $5000....I'm not sure if it's worth the risk. An ARP Odyssey...I can get both in a store right now, if something is wrong they will replace it.

3.) What inspires me. My biggest influences of synthesisers comes from old movie soundtracks. I'm a huge Carpenter fan and a lot of his 80s scores featured a Prophet/ARP set up. Howarth (Carpenter's programmer) didn't get an Oberheim until later on (A four voice rack system with midi). In fact I can only think of a few movie scores that featured an Oberheim only and even then it was either a four voice system or polyphonic OBXa.

I'm still somewhat on the fence...but for $5000 I'm just not sure if it's worth the investment.

[Paul Dither]

I think it all depends on how you look at it or what your priorities are. If you approach it from a rather utilitarian perspective, which is absolutely understandable at this drastic price difference, it sounds as if the Odyssey might be the most reasonable way to go. If it comes to sound however, I'd say there are worlds in between both instruments. After all, the Two Voice Pro definitely has a killer sound. While the Odyssey certainly sounds nice as well and provides some great features like FM and ring modulation, the Two Voice Pro offers not only twice the number of oscillators and that really awesome and flexible filter, but also loads of patching options.

I don't know what led you to consider the Two Voice Pro, but if it was the idea to get that particular sound, I would give it a second thought, since you would definitely not get anywhere near that characteristic sound with another synth.

[Sacred Synthesis]

Lobolives, I completely sympathize with your reasons, and share them myself.  Your reason #2 is a real practical concern.

As we've said before, it's nearly always preferable to have everything under the hood - keyboard, control panel, effects, and so on, all in one instrument.  But sometimes, regarding your present musical needs, you just can't find it in that ideal format.  So, you might as well take advantage of the abundance of modules and assemble your own instrument - be it two Odyssey Desktops, two Oberheim SEMs, a combination of the two, or whatever.  There are so many choices today, so that we might as well use them to design our own very original set ups. 

I do hope that one day DSI inherits the Oberheim tradition.  It would be a natural progression.

[LoboLives]

I think it all depends on how you look at it or what your priorities are. If you approach it from a rather utilitarian perspective, which is absolutely understandable at this drastic price difference, it sounds as if the Odyssey might be the most reasonable way to go. If it comes to sound however, I'd say there are worlds in between both instruments. After all, the Two Voice Pro definitely has a killer sound. While the Odyssey certainly sounds nice as well and provides some great features like FM and ring modulation, the Two Voice Pro offers not only twice the number of oscillators and that really awesome and flexible filter, but also loads of patching options.

I don't know what led you to consider the Two Voice Pro, but if it was the idea to get that particular sound, I would give it a second thought, since you would definitely not get anywhere near that characteristic sound with another synth.

Honestly, what mostly led me to the Two Voice was the sequencer. It's probably the best on board analog sequencer in any synth. It ticks all the boxes and the fact I get two synth engines plus patching capabilities and nice keybed...I mean it's essentially perfect. But is it $5000 perfect? That's the question. Is a great all in one instrument worth the investment or will it simply be overshadowed by the other gear I have. I feel the same way in regards to the Moog Sub 37. It wasn't until recently (after I sent my Prophet 6 away for repairs) did I start to really program it and record with it solely. I was always using it for bass sequences or the occasional lead but I sort of felt bad that I was wasting it's power by just having it as part of a composition. Would the Two Voice fall into the same fate...and would I be willing to pay $5000 to see if it does?

[Paul Dither]

Honestly, what mostly led me to the Two Voice was the sequencer. It's probably the best on board analog sequencer in any synth. It ticks all the boxes and the fact I get two synth engines plus patching capabilities and nice keybed...I mean it's essentially perfect. But is it $5000 perfect? That's the question. Is a great all in one instrument worth the investment or will it simply be overshadowed by the other gear I have. I feel the same way in regards to the Moog Sub 37. It wasn't until recently (after I sent my Prophet 6 away for repairs) did I start to really program it and record with it solely. I was always using it for bass sequences or the occasional lead but I sort of felt bad that I was wasting it's power by just having it as part of a composition. Would the Two Voice fall into the same fate...and would I be willing to pay $5000 to see if it does?

Well, if it's only because of the sequencer you considered the Two Voice Pro, then it's definitely a wiser choice not to get it. While its sequencer is certainly great and even resembles the one of the Sub 37 in some aspects (ratchet for example), the overall tone and sonic quality should be the main reason for getting an SEM-based synth. I don't know if you ever actually played one, but its sound is quite massive, up there with only the Minimoog I'd say.

But if that doesn't matter so much, I'd suggest to rather go down the Odyssey route and pair it (and/or a further synth of your setup) with an Arturia BeatStep Pro, which can be configured to output different voltage standards (volts per octave; Hz per octave) as well as different voltage ranges and offsets, full MIDI control included.

[LoboLives]

Honestly, what mostly led me to the Two Voice was the sequencer. It's probably the best on board analog sequencer in any synth. It ticks all the boxes and the fact I get two synth engines plus patching capabilities and nice keybed...I mean it's essentially perfect. But is it $5000 perfect? That's the question. Is a great all in one instrument worth the investment or will it simply be overshadowed by the other gear I have. I feel the same way in regards to the Moog Sub 37. It wasn't until recently (after I sent my Prophet 6 away for repairs) did I start to really program it and record with it solely. I was always using it for bass sequences or the occasional lead but I sort of felt bad that I was wasting it's power by just having it as part of a composition. Would the Two Voice fall into the same fate...and would I be willing to pay $5000 to see if it does?

Well, if it's only because of the sequencer you considered the Two Voice Pro, then it's definitely a wiser choice not to get it. While its sequencer is certainly great and even resembles the one of the Sub 37 in some aspects (ratchet for example), the overall tone and sonic quality should be the main reason for getting an SEM-based synth. I don't know if you ever actually played one, but its sound is quite massive, up there with only the Minimoog I'd say.

But if that doesn't matter so much, I'd suggest to rather go down the Odyssey route and pair it (and/or a further synth of your setup) with an Arturia BeatStep Pro, which can be configured to output different voltage standards (volts per octave; Hz per octave) as well as different voltage ranges and offsets, full MIDI control included.

I was going to go with an Engine sequencer over anything else as it has the ability to ratchet and chain sequences together into songs.

[LoboLives]

Honestly, what mostly led me to the Two Voice was the sequencer. It's probably the best on board analog sequencer in any synth. It ticks all the boxes and the fact I get two synth engines plus patching capabilities and nice keybed...I mean it's essentially perfect. But is it $5000 perfect? That's the question. Is a great all in one instrument worth the investment or will it simply be overshadowed by the other gear I have. I feel the same way in regards to the Moog Sub 37. It wasn't until recently (after I sent my Prophet 6 away for repairs) did I start to really program it and record with it solely. I was always using it for bass sequences or the occasional lead but I sort of felt bad that I was wasting it's power by just having it as part of a composition. Would the Two Voice fall into the same fate...and would I be willing to pay $5000 to see if it does?

Well, if it's only because of the sequencer you considered the Two Voice Pro, then it's definitely a wiser choice not to get it. While its sequencer is certainly great and even resembles the one of the Sub 37 in some aspects (ratchet for example), the overall tone and sonic quality should be the main reason for getting an SEM-based synth. I don't know if you ever actually played one, but its sound is quite massive, up there with only the Minimoog I'd say.

But if that doesn't matter so much, I'd suggest to rather go down the Odyssey route and pair it (and/or a further synth of your setup) with an Arturia BeatStep Pro, which can be configured to output different voltage standards (volts per octave; Hz per octave) as well as different voltage ranges and offsets, full MIDI control included.

I was going to go with an Engine sequencer over anything else as it has the ability to ratchet and chain sequences together into songs.

Update on the Two Voice. I was at the only store in the city here that deals with Tom and the scheduled Two Voice Pro still has not arrived. After speaking to the sales rep he said “I had someone place an order in March or April for an SEM Pro and we still haven’t got it and it’s October. I don’t mind ordering you this thing but you may be waiting a really long time. I can have the ARPs in three days, I can have DSIs stuff in a week I could have Moog stuff in the next day but with Tom I can’t give you an exact date. They told us they were ready to ship the Two Voice Pro weeks ago and it’s still not here. To order it I would need at least a 20% diposit...and that’s about $1000 roughly. “

So I’m at the decision now where I could spend the $5k on ARPs, a sequencer, a mixer, a DAW, and maybe have some left over for guitar pedals....or I could spend it on something I might not see for a year and be out $1000 just to request it. Thoughts?

[Paul Dither]

So I’m at the decision now where I could spend the $5k on ARPs, a sequencer, a mixer, a DAW, and maybe have some left over for guitar pedals....or I could spend it on something I might not see for a year and be out $1000 just to request it. Thoughts?

Those are obviously significantly different purchase options and I would say it all comes down to how much you'd like to own a Two Voice Pro for what only a Two Voice Pro can do (sound, features, overall package). What an instrument is actually worth to us is determined by so many factors, some of which are not even following a rational pattern, so it's very hard to come up with a suggestion in this case.

While the second option (ARPs, sequencer, etc.) seems to present itself as more practical by sheer quantitative means, it can't replace a Two Voice Pro and vice versa. All I know is that if I had the money to spend on a Two Voice Pro right now, I would do it. Not only because I enjoyed its sound so much when actually checking one out at a store, but also because they might not be around for that long anymore.

[Sacred Synthesis]

The prudent decision seems so obvious that there's little reflection needed.  There are too many risks involved in getting a Two-Voice Pro, so that continuing to insist that one must have one regardless pushes fastidiousness to an absurd degree.  There's no question this is a superb synthesizer, but is it so superb that no other synthesizer on God's green earth could substitute for it?  And Paul is right, it might not be around for that long anymore.  Are you willing, then, to pay top dollar for an instrument that will soon offer the challenges of maintaining a vintage piece of equipment?  Because it will be vintage soon enough. 

There are just too many uncertainties regarding all things Oberheim.

[Paul Dither]

The prudent decision seems so obvious that there's little reflection needed.  There are too many risks involved in getting a Two-Voice Pro, so that continuing to insist that one must have one regardless pushes fastidiousness to an absurd degree.  There's no question this is a superb synthesizer, but is it so superb that no other synthesizer on God's green earth could substitute for it?  And Paul is right, it might not be around for that long anymore.  Are you willing, then, to pay top dollar for an instrument that will soon offer the challenges of maintaining a vintage piece of equipment?  Because it will be vintage soon enough. 

There are just too many uncertainties regarding all things Oberheim.

Well, not all synth decisions are entirely prudent though. If one connects with a particular sound or feature set instantly, things like the production run don't necessarily play a great role. I for one would come to the opposite conclusion as you did exactly because it's not clear for how much longer the Two Voice Pro will still be manufactured. So given I had the money and wouldn't have to sell almost all of my current instruments for it, I'd get it rather sooner than later. As far as I know there are also no particular rarities in the Two Voice Pro, which would make it non-maintainable in the future. So I think the concern about whether it'll be vintage soon shouldn't be a huge one. It's still built with current technology and commonly available parts. And I have not yet heard of any circuit issues.

Whether it's so superb that no other synth could substitute for it, is of course a question LoboLives has to answer for himself. I would answer that question with a clear "yes," but that's only my personal opinion on the Two Voice Pro, which is why I can't really take the ultimate decision away from LoboLives. The only thing I know is that I mostly care about the Two Voice Pro's sonic qualities while it is my understanding that this is rather secondary for LoboLives (sorry for talking about you in the 3rd person the whole time). And if it wasn't for the sound, I don't know why I would get a Two Voice Pro in the first place. So maybe the latter balances my personal opinion a little.

[Sacred Synthesis]

Yes, of course the decision is for Lobolives, but he did ask for our "thoughts".  My thought is to lean towards the objective and away from the subjective.  $3,500 is a lot of money to spend in light of the mentioned uncertainties, when so many other excellent instruments can be found without them.  And there is the issue of maintenance to consider, especially if Tom is not in business several years from now.  Parts availability is one concern, but so isn't warrantee and service.  Not to mention that there's uncertainty even as to when the instrument will be available. 

I'm suggesting caution, rather than an impulsive purchase.  Sometimes an instrument's uniqueness just isn't worth its demands.

[LoboLives]

Yes, of course the decision is for Lobolives, but he did ask for our "thoughts".  My thought is to lean towards the objective and away from the subjective.  $3,500 is a lot of money to spend in light of the mentioned uncertainties, when so many other excellent instruments can be found without them.  And there is the issue of maintenance to consider, especially if Tom is not in business several years from now.  Parts availability is one concern, but so isn't warrantee and service.  Not to mention that there's uncertainty even as to when the instrument will be available. 

I'm suggesting caution, rather than an impulsive purchase.  Sometimes an instrument's uniqueness just isn't worth its demands.

It’s actually $5000 for me not $3599. Weak Canadian dollar and all that.

It’s actually a fairly reliable piece of equipment and Moog Audio said they can easily repair them because the circuitry is fairly simple so maintenance isn’t a factor it’s more the waiting time and cost.

[Gerry Havinga]

Yes, of course the decision is for Lobolives, but he did ask for our "thoughts".  My thought is to lean towards the objective and away from the subjective.  $3,500 is a lot of money to spend in light of the mentioned uncertainties, when so many other excellent instruments can be found without them.  And there is the issue of maintenance to consider, especially if Tom is not in business several years from now.  Parts availability is one concern, but so isn't warrantee and service.  Not to mention that there's uncertainty even as to when the instrument will be available. 

I'm suggesting caution, rather than an impulsive purchase.  Sometimes an instrument's uniqueness just isn't worth its demands.

It’s actually $5000 for me not $3599. Weak Canadian dollar and all that.

It’s actually a fairly reliable piece of equipment and Moog Audio said they can easily repair them because the circuitry is fairly simple so maintenance isn’t a factor it’s more the waiting time and cost.

For that price and if the bill of materials is readily available someplace, you can almost build it yourself. 

https://moogfest2017.sched.com/speaker/hacking_systems.6v1hsje

[LoboLives]

The prudent decision seems so obvious that there's little reflection needed.  There are too many risks involved in getting a Two-Voice Pro, so that continuing to insist that one must have one regardless pushes fastidiousness to an absurd degree.  There's no question this is a superb synthesizer, but is it so superb that no other synthesizer on God's green earth could substitute for it?  And Paul is right, it might not be around for that long anymore.  Are you willing, then, to pay top dollar for an instrument that will soon offer the challenges of maintaining a vintage piece of equipment?  Because it will be vintage soon enough. 

There are just too many uncertainties regarding all things Oberheim.

Well, not all synth decisions are entirely prudent though. If one connects with a particular sound or feature set instantly, things like the production run don't necessarily play a great role. I for one would come to the opposite conclusion as you did exactly because it's not clear for how much longer the Two Voice Pro will still be manufactured. So given I had the money and wouldn't have to sell almost all of my current instruments for it, I'd get it rather sooner than later. As far as I know there are also no particular rarities in the Two Voice Pro, which would make it non-maintainable in the future. So I think the concern about whether it'll be vintage soon shouldn't be a huge one. It's still built with current technology and commonly available parts. And I have not yet heard of any circuit issues.

Whether it's so superb that no other synth could substitute for it, is of course a question LoboLives has to answer for himself. I would answer that question with a clear "yes," but that's only my personal opinion on the Two Voice Pro, which is why I can't really take the ultimate decision away from LoboLives. The only thing I know is that I mostly care about the Two Voice Pro's sonic qualities while it is my understanding that this is rather secondary for LoboLives (sorry for talking about you in the 3rd person the whole time). And if it wasn't for the sound, I don't know why I would get a Two Voice Pro in the first place. So maybe the latter balances my personal opinion a little.

Don’t get me wrong I love the SEM’s sound as well. It’s sequencer is also something I’m interested in. It’s more of a question of what I need at this moment. I’m looking at DAWs, and a Soundcraft mixer as I am currently redesigning my studio so although I do love a Two Voice there I still a lot of unknowns. I flat out asked them that if I place the order and Tom (who’s over 80) were to have something tragic happen what exactly would be the status of the order. Likely I’d receive a store credit but like I said someone ordered just one SEM Pro in March and it’s still not in.

It’s really a question of $1250 down payment for something that I may not get for another year. Which...mmm I guess really isn’t horrible because it’s not $5k upfront.

I could always get the ARPs in the meantime to get recording and place the order for the Two Voice. Ironically it’s waiting time may be beneficial allowing me time to save up for the rest of the payment. 

I mean eventually I’d like to get some SEMs in my set up (hey...ARPs and SEMs in a set up together doesn’t sound too bad jso maybe I’m overthinking it and panicking. I guess there is a time constraint because Tom obviously can’t beat Father Time and the future of his instruments is uncertain but I guess it doesn’t matter if I order it now or later cause I’m still going to be waiting months for the thing and if anything were to happen to Tom I still wouldn’t have a Two Voice Pro.

I hate thinking in those terms but I can’t help it.