Prophet 6 or Prophet 08 - a video comparison

StarskyCarr · « **on:** December 08, 2015, 05:42:17 AM »

I've recently purchased a Prophet 6 and love it. I also have a Prophet 08 and love that!!

While I was considering if I needed another polysynth (who doesn't!) I had difficulty getting any real unbiased info comparing the 2 synths. I know you can buy one and send it back within 30 days from most retailers, but for those who'd rather take a little longer to make a decision or those further afield who can't return goods, I thought I'd make some comparison videos.

1. Oscillators and Basic Modulation
2. Filters
3. Making Simple Pads
4. Sequencers and Arpeggiators
5. Complex Pads

I hope its of some use to someone... or I've wasted my time... )

Enjoy.

BTW I've also posted this on the Prophet 6 pages - hope that's not breaking any forum rules.

Starsky

Sacred Synthesis · « **Reply #1 on:** December 08, 2015, 07:36:35 AM »

Thanks for this little series. It was an excellent idea.

I've given a quick listen to each video. Honestly, I thought the Prophet '08 held up just fine against the Prophet 6. I was expecting the latter to make mince meat of the former, but not at all. But the two do seem to make a superb pair, as you say. Thanks, again, for your hard work on this project. A video comparison of these two instruments begged to be made.

lnetzel · « **Reply #2 on:** December 08, 2015, 01:51:33 PM »

I really appreciate the effort you put down into filming and recording. I did a patching tutorial video of my Korg MS10 and it took a lot of time planning and stuff so... nice one brother!

The first basic patches, not very different in sound. I was, as Sacred Synthesis also mentioned, surprised about how similar they sound on basic wave forms. I was also surprised to hear the depth of the P'08 with high resonant and low cut off. Very deep sub there.

Note: To latch the Arpeggio, enabled it, press the notes and then hold the arpeggio button until it blinks slightly

StarskyCarr · « **Reply #3 on:** December 09, 2015, 07:43:53 AM »

Quote from: lnetzel on December 08, 2015, 01:51:33 PM

Note: To latch the Arpeggio, enabled it, press the notes and then hold the arpeggio button until it blinks slightly

Thanks for the info... it was all worth it just for that!

I have to say I was surprised how close I could get them with very little effort. Once I had positioned them physically right next to each other they were much easier to compare. The P6 is so easy, but has been designed that way, making it appear very 'musical' from the first touch. The P8 does take more effort, but in the mix I doubt anyone would tell the difference. Having said that, sometimes speed is of the essence and quick hands on sound creation and editing definitely has its place.... so I'm still no closer to a verdict!

BobTheDog · « **Reply #4 on:** December 09, 2015, 10:56:22 AM »

Very good and informative videos.

I think they show how the P8 shines in a price comparison type of way to the P6.

Interesting really as I have been reading a lot on the information super dirt track about how much better the P6 sounds over the P8.

dslsynth · « **Reply #5 on:** December 09, 2015, 02:31:11 PM »

Just wanted to say that I did enjoy seeing some of these videos too. One can hear a difference on the instrument tone with Prophet-6 having a bit more to offer IMHO. In best of all worlds we would have Prophet-6 analog soul with Prophet '08 digital control. But right now there is a choice between sound and features.

Paul Dither · « **Reply #6 on:** December 09, 2015, 05:30:51 PM »

Having played both in person, I'd say that the Prophet-6 sound has more weight to it. Despite having a simpler mod matrix, it also offers a sub oscillator, the cross modulation that is impossible to achieve with the Prophet '08, and flexible unisono modes. It also has a nicer feeling keyboard. So there are a couple of factors that don't make both redundant. In the end it depends on what you want, or what is more important to you.

Quote from: dslsynth on December 09, 2015, 02:31:11 PM

But right now there is a choice between sound and features.

That's basically what it comes down to, I'd agree. (I'm not saying that the Prophet '08 sounds bad by any means. It's just that the Prophet-6 does sound better to my ears.)

lnetzel · « **Reply #7 on:** December 10, 2015, 12:11:23 AM »

When you watch all 5 episodes it becomes clear it's two widely different machines. I feel the orginal "worrying idea" of P6 just beeing a better sounding (and replacing) the P08 is 100% killed off. Now, go make music with either one, or both

Jason · « **Reply #8 on:** December 10, 2015, 09:16:03 AM »

I enjoyed these videos immensely and have watched each a couple times. Like many others, I have been watching YouTube videos to try to compare these two synthesizers, and, also like others, I don't have a nearby store that has both to compare in person. (Where is such a store? It's difficult on most sites to see what DSI they actually have in stock.) Your videos are valuable for that reason.

On another level, I greatly enjoyed watching someone who really understands both synthesizer programming and these two keyboards in particular, easily navigating the parameters to vary sounds. I'm new to the Prophet '08, and it's educational to watch someone farther along the learning curve. For example, while I've read the manual's description of programming the sequencer and have heard many sequences online, I'm not aware of another video that demonstrates how to set up a sequence. I would have enjoyed watching the few minutes between videos 4 and 5, when you were adding the modulations.

Sacred Synthesis · « **Reply #9 on:** December 10, 2015, 09:43:26 AM »

Quote from: Jason on December 10, 2015, 09:16:03 AM

On another level, I greatly enjoyed watching someone who really understands both synthesizer programming and these two keyboards in particular, easily navigating the parameters to vary sounds. I'm new to the Prophet '08, and it's educational to watch someone farther along the learning curve. For example, while I've read the manual's description of programming the sequencer and have heard many sequences online, I'm not aware of another video that demonstrates how to set up a sequence. I would have enjoyed watching the few minutes between videos 4 and 5, when you were adding the modulations.

I realize that DSI is a small company. Regardless, I do wish that DSI would, in some capacity, sponsor their own video demonstrations of their instruments for educational purposes. Yes, Dave's introductory videos offer a tiny glimpse into a instrument, and the recent posting of Doty's videos is a good start, but I'd like to see thorough video demonstrations become the norm. There is no shortage of knowledge or talent around here. I would cite Paul Dither's series on the Pro 2 and the above series by Starsky Carr as proof. They demonstrate how proficient many people have become with video production and, with their work, could offer a substantial service to DSI. I'm suggesting only that DSI offer such persons either a modest stipend for their work or a decent discount for DSI products, and that their videos be posted on the appropriate pages of the DSI web site. The point is that DSI provide "official" demonstrations for each instrument as a service to owners and potential customers. All of us could benefit from this service. I imagine DSI would have to turn down many offers to produce such demonstrations, because many of us would love to do it.

dslsynth · « **Reply #10 on:** December 10, 2015, 01:13:51 PM »

Quote from: Paul Dither on December 09, 2015, 05:30:51 PM

Having played both in person, I'd say that the Prophet-6 sound has more weight to it.
[...]
That's basically what it comes down to, I'd agree.

So what hopefully will happen one day is a keyboard with substantial modulation features and the analog electronics features of Prophet-6. Right now its either one or the other.

Oh and its nice to see that the more evolved analog electronics in form of VCOs and discrete filters indeed does translate into a better sounding machine compared to the classic rattle-a-curtis-chip instruments.

Jason · « **Reply #11 on:** December 11, 2015, 08:12:20 AM »

Quote from: Sacred Synthesis on December 10, 2015, 09:43:26 AM

Regardless, I do wish that DSI would, in some capacity, sponsor their own video demonstrations of their instruments for educational purposes. Starsky Carr

I certainly agree. The average keyboardist simply cannot program on the level of some of you. StrangeQuarkStar, Starsky, and Sacred Synthesis recently demonstrated sounds that are better than most of what I've found in the presets of the '08 (for the music that I'm into). Most keyboardists that play in cover bands are now used to having hundreds and hundreds of sounds in other brand's keyboards that they can combine or edit to get the sounds for classic pop/rock. Other than Tom Sawyer, I don't think I'd use any of the '08 sounds meant to cover a classic. Even the Toto sounds aren't right. The pop/rock soundsets that I have for my Yamaha are much closer... even though the Prophet is clearly capable of sounding much better. I think that even the sounds that I've created (Only Time Will Tell, On the Loose, Separate Ways and others by Journey) would have helped sell the keyboard because most people judge a synth by the presets, and many bands do covers. I think that DSI missed the boat with the '08 presets and could have been much more popular synthesizer.

Sacred Synthesis · « **Reply #12 on:** December 11, 2015, 08:24:13 AM »

I've never used even one of DSI's factory presets. Their presets seem to be intended to showcase the complexity of an instrument, rather than its musicality. They give the passing synthesist an immediate idea of its depth, but I'd be surprised if many of the presets remain in use. If I could, I'd wipe out every one and replace them all with an init. patch.

Strange Quark Star · « **Reply #13 on:** December 11, 2015, 10:06:33 AM »

Thanks again, Jason!

Have you tried the Prophet 5 factory patch recreations? They are mostly simpler and less busy than the P'08 presets but I quite like some of them. Perhaps they are closer to what you have in mind, especially if you look more classic sounds.

Jason · « **Reply #14 on:** December 11, 2015, 11:22:05 AM »

Quote from: Strange Quark Star on December 11, 2015, 10:06:33 AM

Have you tried the Prophet 5 factory patch recreations? They are mostly simpler and less busy than the P'08 presets but I quite like some of them. Perhaps they are closer to what you have in mind, especially if you look more classic sounds.

No. I heard that they recreated them for the Prophet 6, but I'm not aware of them for the Prophet '08. I'd be very interested. Where/how do I get them? Thanks!

Similarly, I'd be interested if anyone knows of a website that has printed classic patches that would work on the '08. I used to really enjoy how Keyboard magazine used to put patches in a lot of their issues years ago.

dslsynth · « **Reply #15 on:** December 11, 2015, 12:00:08 PM »

Quote from: Jason on December 11, 2015, 11:22:05 AM

No. I heard that they recreated them for the Prophet 6, but I'm not aware of them for the Prophet '08. I'd be very interested. Where/how do I get them? Thanks!

If you look really closely here you will find them:
http://www.davesmithinstruments.com/prophet-08-factory-sounds/

StarskyCarr · « **Reply #16 on:** December 11, 2015, 12:33:06 PM »

Quote from: Jason on December 10, 2015, 09:16:03 AM

I'm new to the Prophet '08, and it's educational to watch someone farther along the learning curve. For example, while I've read the manual's description of programming the sequencer and have heard many sequences online, I'm not aware of another video that demonstrates how to set up a sequence. I would have enjoyed watching the few minutes between videos 4 and 5, when you were adding the modulations.

I've uploaded a Prophet 08 walkthrough today. It seems there' not much info around for it, maybe it was released pre the era of Youtube demos.

There a bit ore in there re the sequencer. I actually made something quite nice in there... which I've now tweeked into something more polished so might do a short video showing the results while everything is set up to record the videos in the studio.

For the LFO modulations in video 4 I simply went to each LFO set the destinations to:

1 - Osc1Freq
2 - LowPass
3 - Resonance
4 - Noise Level

I then added a random 'Amount' to each and set the Freq to various steps of the beat (i.e. they're all synced - the synced rates are found by turning the encoders fully clockwise)... I think I also added Env 3 to one of the modulation destinations, and added LFO 1 freq as the destination to Env 3.... just messing about really, but it sounded OK for demo purposes. I do something similar in the new video for the sequencer.

Cheers.

Sacred Synthesis · « **Reply #17 on:** December 11, 2015, 01:08:52 PM »

Another video for these two instruments? Great! I'm looking forward to watching it later. Good going, Starsky. You're feeding the monster.

Jason · « **Reply #18 on:** December 11, 2015, 01:27:49 PM »

Oh Great! I'm looking forward to watching that. I can't watch it tonight though. 50 minutes. Cool.

Jason · « **Reply #19 on:** December 11, 2015, 01:37:04 PM »

Quote from: dslsynth on December 11, 2015, 12:00:08 PM

If you look really closely here you will find them:
http://www.davesmithinstruments.com/prophet-08-factory-sounds/

Thanks to both of you. Somehow I missed that. I had downloaded the list of sounds before mine arrived and haven't gone back to that page since. Great. So now I need to read up a bit on how to save my new ones and download these. Do I need the editor?