We need a great Pro 2 editor & librarian

jobinho · « **on:** November 11, 2015, 05:07:30 AM »

I tried the Sound Tower editor and was wholly unimpressed. The aesthetics, UI & usability all falling way short.

This synth is crying out for a comprehensive and well designed software component. Just the ability to rename and organise patches effectively, as well as enhance patch creation - would really aid the Pro 2.

(edit: just demoing the latest update from SoundTower - it seems less buggy and more usable - would be great to have waveform icons that match the ACTUAL waveforms - also drag and drop for presets would be great)

Shaw · « **Reply #1 on:** November 12, 2015, 05:19:18 PM »

I'll second that! Love my Pro 2... DSI has really outdone themselves. On all levels. But a synth of this depth, simply needs a computer based editor.

Cheers!

daj · « **Reply #2 on:** November 14, 2015, 05:11:25 PM »

I agree 100% - these days a Patch management app is minimum requirement.
With DSI creating their own forum, I hope this is a sign of things to come with DSI catching up.
Clavia NL software rocks.

dslsynth · « **Reply #3 on:** November 15, 2015, 02:57:12 PM »

Quote from: daj on November 14, 2015, 05:11:25 PM

With DSI creating their own forum, I hope this is a sign of things to come with DSI catching up.

I have a hard time imaging the DSI that I know do their own editors. Perhaps an outsourced solution could help them. But given how their current software development resources are and how much work making a good editor is I would be very surprised if that ever happened. Actually it would be way better if they did more OS updates instead of making their own editors!

And yeah it would be nice with high quality editor solutions being made for DSI products. Its really sad that the Soundtower editors do not works as well as customers are hoping for.

Anyhow, this thread could be the perfect place for you to describe the editor and librarian features you dream about having! ;-)

Shaw · « **Reply #4 on:** November 16, 2015, 04:49:29 AM »

Quote from: dslsynth on November 15, 2015, 02:57:12 PM

Anyhow, this thread could be the perfect place for you to describe the editor and librarian features you dream about having! ;-)

That part is easy. For the editor, access to every synth parameter, logically laid out on as few pages as possible. Saving macros would also be a nice feature... For example, saving the settings for part or all of the step sequencer, or the settings of the entire filter section.

For the librarian, the ability to copy, paste, store, rename, and rearrange the patches and banks. That should cover it.

Cheers!

jobinho · « **Reply #5 on:** December 07, 2015, 02:12:06 PM »

Just demoing the latest update from SoundTower - it seems less buggy and more usable - would be great to have waveform icons that match the ACTUAL waveforms - also drag and drop for presets would be great

DrysyBeat_72 · « **Reply #6 on:** December 08, 2015, 03:28:44 AM »

Surely it's only a matter of time until they do so, after all the Mopho has one.

PaleSkinnySwede · « **Reply #7 on:** December 30, 2015, 02:11:40 AM »

Quote from: DrysyBeat_72 on December 08, 2015, 03:28:44 AM

Surely it's only a matter of time until they do so, after all the Mopho has one.

Isn't the Mopho kind of hard to sell without an editor?

DavidDever · « **Reply #8 on:** January 03, 2016, 07:24:17 AM »

http://www.synthgraphics.com/mopho_tetra.html, using a Behringer BCR-2000

mr.highcut · « **Reply #9 on:** February 14, 2016, 11:53:59 AM »

Hi everyone!

I am looking for a solution to save my patches - without overwriting patches from the factory and userbanks. Can I do this with the Soundtower software?

Thank you for the help and I am super happy with the Pro2 - such a beast of a synth

Best, mr.highcut

goodweather · « **Reply #10 on:** February 15, 2016, 12:46:52 AM »

FYI I started building a Ctrlr Pro2 panel. Just give me some time. It will be free. Will post some pictures soon.
Of course you can also have a look to the SoundTower editor.

jobinho · « **Reply #11 on:** February 17, 2016, 11:49:54 AM »

Quote from: goodweather on February 15, 2016, 12:46:52 AM

FYI I started building a Ctrlr Pro2 panel. Just give me some time. It will be free. Will post some pictures soon.
Of course you can also have a look to the SoundTower editor.

Sounds great, please do keep us posted

Will it feature a librarian?

goodweather · « **Reply #12 on:** February 17, 2016, 12:21:31 PM »

Quote from: jobinho on February 17, 2016, 11:49:54 AM

Quote from: goodweather on February 15, 2016, 12:46:52 AM
FYI I started building a Ctrlr Pro2 panel. Just give me some time. It will be free. Will post some pictures soon.
Of course you can also have a look to the SoundTower editor.

Sounds great, please do keep us posted Will it feature a librarian?

Yes, I'll try. Hopefully we have good documentation from DSI...

blewis · « **Reply #13 on:** February 18, 2016, 05:05:05 AM »

Quote from: goodweather on February 17, 2016, 12:21:31 PM

Quote from: jobinho on February 17, 2016, 11:49:54 AM
Quote from: goodweather on February 15, 2016, 12:46:52 AM
FYI I started building a Ctrlr Pro2 panel. Just give me some time. It will be free. Will post some pictures soon.
Of course you can also have a look to the SoundTower editor.

Sounds great, please do keep us posted Will it feature a librarian?

Yes, I'll try. Hopefully we have good documentation from DSI...

Well, there's the rub.

The SYSEX docs are more than likely not good enough for you to make your panel. The parameter locations DO NOT match the NRPN locations. At least they did not on the Prophet 6.

If it helps, I can send you what work I started on the Prophet6. I had a debug routine whereby you can twiddle a knob, do a dump, and the debugger would display what SYSEX byte changed. It's not automated since you have to turn a knob on the synth, so it's going to take maybe a couple hundred passes.

What I really wanted was a patch librarian, but the Ctrlr.org API for that part is poorly documented - doesn't exist. I just wanted to make a patch librarian but I got held up off the bat with incomplete SYSEX docs from DSI and no docs for the MIDI lib stuff from ctrlr.org

Let me know if you want to see my hacked code for the Prophet 6. If you're good at this stuff, you may be further along than I already was.

goodweather · « **Reply #14 on:** February 18, 2016, 08:46:56 AM »

Thx for your support offer. At this time not needed... but maybe later

FYI, I have decoded most of the Moog Sub37 sysex dump by indeed using the same technique (try to set all params to 0, dump with Midi-OX and save as reference, then change each param one by one from min to max value and dump then reset and do next param; same for multi-values params; then compare with reference file using HxD, one param at a time) and I can now read their files and display them in my Sub37 editor.

Here I have now made the panel layout with all Pro2 parameters.
During w-e and next week I will give correct names and do the real time NRPN handling (bi-directional).
Then week after I'll do all "On value change" methods that will display explanation from the manual on the current parameter + saved value + current value (I did this for the Sub37 and it is really cool).
Then will build the read single program dump stuff.
Will not address the sequencer in a first instance. I will focus on program editor + program reading/writing + librarian

I attach a picture showing the idea of the layout (at least as it is right now)...

blewis · « **Reply #15 on:** February 18, 2016, 04:32:23 PM »

Looks great!

jobinho · « **Reply #16 on:** February 18, 2016, 04:37:45 PM »

Quote from: goodweather on February 18, 2016, 08:46:56 AM

I attach a picture showing the idea of the layout (at least as it is right now)...

Fantastic... will this work as an AU? If it had instantaneous recall for unlimited number of patches that would be amazing - and id happily pay for it. This is where the soundtower librarian fails.

goodweather · « **Reply #17 on:** February 19, 2016, 04:03:02 AM »

Quote from: jobinho on February 18, 2016, 04:37:45 PM

Fantastic... will this work as an AU? If it had instantaneous recall for unlimited number of patches that would be amazing - and id happily pay for it. This is where the soundtower librarian fails.

Didn't know this.
Ctrlr gives the possibility to have standalone, VST and AU panel versions so even if I worked in standalone mode until now I should create VST and AU versions of the same panel as well.
And it will not be needed to pay

Ctrlr is freely developed by Atom and different people around the world are making panels for their own use and are happy to share them.
Of course you depend on goodwill and willingness and time to spend. Maybe you will not have all the features you dreamed of but it is free and you have full freedom to take an existing panel and adapt it further

binman_uk · « **Reply #18 on:** March 18, 2016, 04:19:42 PM »

Any update on the ctrlr panel?

goodweather · « **Reply #19 on:** March 20, 2016, 07:56:40 AM »

Sure!
Things are going very well but anyway taking time even if I'm working on it a bit every day.
I have all the extracts from the manual about the parameters.
I have built and fixed the wave shapes display and the filter routing display. The displays and controls are enabled/disabled according to the wave and filter selections.
I had to reverse engineer the sysex program data dump but this is now done (except the sequencer part) and I'm busy to do each OnChange method for each parameter.
I can upload a program and today I have fixed the bank and program handling (it will be possible to load and save in different banks/programs). I put the handling logic on paper and now I have to implement and test it.
I have also started the librarian and can read sound banks in a very efficient way. However I will work further on it once the single program load and save will be finished.
You will have 2 disk banks and the 4 user banks to play with.
The layout is still not fully fixed.
I have also settled the base for an ini file that will contain the banks used and some other parameters.
I have also added the Global parameters tab content.
Here are a few pictures...

So, just a bit patience. The most important is that I don't see any blocking issue as I got with the Sub37